SC or MUgen?
Joined: May 2001
Posts: 3,332
Likes: 2
From: On a fencepost
You have to decide for yourself what kind of driving experience you're after. You can make good increase while staying N/A. Mugen make some good parts, but they don't make the best in all areas. Decide what you're after - driving experience, not numbers - and then it's possible to give you some sensible suggestions on what could be a good option, costs etc.
The comment on electronics if you supercharge (in another thread) is a simple one. If you want the engine to last, add proper timing, fueling and boost control. The Greddy E-Manage (or a Unichip) seems the minimum that's powerful enough to setup properly, with fully programmable ECU's like AEM's EMS, being the high end option. The standard supercharger kits include crude fuel management, and rely on the knock sensor to retard timing to stop detonation. The knock sensor can only detect when the combustion hasn't been ideal after the fact - not before. The reason proper managment isn't included with the kits is cost - it adds quite a chunk. If you don't, you'll save money in the short run but pay far more when something does go wrong.
The question shouldn't really be SC or Mugen, but rather you be asking yourself what gains you want, then ask the question how best to get them. Going into major N/A or forced induction tuning without deciding what you're after first, is a very good way of making the whole lost cost a lot more than you intended, and perhaps not acheiving what you want anyway.
-Brian.
The comment on electronics if you supercharge (in another thread) is a simple one. If you want the engine to last, add proper timing, fueling and boost control. The Greddy E-Manage (or a Unichip) seems the minimum that's powerful enough to setup properly, with fully programmable ECU's like AEM's EMS, being the high end option. The standard supercharger kits include crude fuel management, and rely on the knock sensor to retard timing to stop detonation. The knock sensor can only detect when the combustion hasn't been ideal after the fact - not before. The reason proper managment isn't included with the kits is cost - it adds quite a chunk. If you don't, you'll save money in the short run but pay far more when something does go wrong.
The question shouldn't really be SC or Mugen, but rather you be asking yourself what gains you want, then ask the question how best to get them. Going into major N/A or forced induction tuning without deciding what you're after first, is a very good way of making the whole lost cost a lot more than you intended, and perhaps not acheiving what you want anyway.
-Brian.
Thread Starter
Registered User
Joined: Mar 2003
Posts: 916
Likes: 0
From: SE
Thanks BM
What I was really interested in was the Mugen NA option, Insurance dictates that and SC is no longer.
I was under the impression that Honda UK did a Mugen upgrade kit for the S is this true? and if it is what does it include and how much does it cost?
What I was really interested in was the Mugen NA option, Insurance dictates that and SC is no longer.
I was under the impression that Honda UK did a Mugen upgrade kit for the S is this true? and if it is what does it include and how much does it cost?
Joined: May 2001
Posts: 3,332
Likes: 2
From: On a fencepost
Honda UK considered an official UK Mugen car, but didn't in the end offer one. Souther Counties (a dealer) offers what they call a Mugen S2000 - check their website for info.
Out of what they fit, the two most important parts are the exhaust manifold and the intake. The exhaust is for sound, weight savings, and also is friendly to making more power in the future. The airbox, they don't install fully as per instructions (don't cut the air guide, restricting the air feed to the airbox. Done because of an unwarranted fear of water ingestion. According to Mugen, you have to drice through something like 10cm deep water for any risk....). They will do this part properly if specifically asked - they installed FrankyNuckles one correctly when asked.
The airbox is great, but since it requires cutting the bonnet to clear it, it's a mod for the more dedicated. The exhaust manifold doesn't require any cutting or permament modifications. Cost, probably between
Out of what they fit, the two most important parts are the exhaust manifold and the intake. The exhaust is for sound, weight savings, and also is friendly to making more power in the future. The airbox, they don't install fully as per instructions (don't cut the air guide, restricting the air feed to the airbox. Done because of an unwarranted fear of water ingestion. According to Mugen, you have to drice through something like 10cm deep water for any risk....). They will do this part properly if specifically asked - they installed FrankyNuckles one correctly when asked.
The airbox is great, but since it requires cutting the bonnet to clear it, it's a mod for the more dedicated. The exhaust manifold doesn't require any cutting or permament modifications. Cost, probably between
Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 25,566
Likes: 2
From: Heart of England
Been in to Southern Counties. To get the UK warranty on the car with the Mugen kit it has to be fitted to a new car and sold as a Mugen S2000. They also get you to sign a disclaimer saying you are aware the Mugen CAI makes the car prone to Hydrolocking and accept this is not covered by the warranty. This cost
Joined: May 2001
Posts: 3,332
Likes: 2
From: On a fencepost
Originally posted by mikey k
To get the UK warranty on the car with the Mugen kit it has to be fitted to a new car and sold as a Mugen S2000.
To get the UK warranty on the car with the Mugen kit it has to be fitted to a new car and sold as a Mugen S2000.
Originally posted by mikey k
They also get you to sign a disclaimer saying you are aware the Mugen CAI makes the car prone to Hydrolocking and accept this is not covered by the warranty.
They also get you to sign a disclaimer saying you are aware the Mugen CAI makes the car prone to Hydrolocking and accept this is not covered by the warranty.
Originally posted by mikey k
They will retrofit parts but this invalidates the warranty
They will retrofit parts but this invalidates the warranty
Originally posted by mikey k
Having looked at the curves there is bugger all in it from the stock car.
Having looked at the curves there is bugger all in it from the stock car.
Whether it's value for money or not depends purely on viewpoint. That debate ignites every so often on the US forums. If you're after bhp/
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Joined: May 2001
Posts: 3,332
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From: On a fencepost
Here's a link to the debate (okay, at times slagging match) about the gains with the Mugen parts, and the comparison to forced induction etc. There are a lot of thoughts from people in both camps, so it's well worth a read.
-Brian.
-Brian.
