No limits tyre/wheel combo for track - 275/305+? No hellacrap
08-19-2017, 05:34 AM
#1
No limits tyre/wheel combo for track - 275/305+? No hellacrap
Hello all,
Hate to create a new thread on this but have been digging into this issue over the last few years while my build is being completed, not really finding concrete info, or broken links/photos so cannot verify it as it's old. So I'd love to hear/see from those who have done it, what have you fit, is the camber close to stock - must be no more than +/- 0.5deg from stock to get the car re-certified, can always adjust after
I do not have adjustable suspension beyond usual adjustable coilovers (crappy K-sport for now until car is dialed in on track), but can/likely will in future upgrades as that's really about it left to do on the car beyond completely stripping the interior again. Sound deadening and rear interior has been taken out etc so some weight reduction performed.
This is for a caged, dry sump LS3 track car which is still road legal, thus I'd love to be able to drive it to the track. Low estimates of 460Whp and 430tq.
In future I'd like to have a second set of rims via a tow bar box mount and a few in the boot.
Requirements
Next problem is tyre availability/choice.....
Would love to whack 285 or more on front and 305+ on rear.
In future car will be going to either E-swap or 496/502ci, current cammed/dry sump LS3 will kill the rears as it is, so the more the merrier.
Use will be track days, would like to give time attack a go, road racing/hill climbs, targa etc and also wish to set the Honda all motor NZ 1320 record. Bit of an all rounder until I figure out what I love most. Was more of a road racer on pretty modified superbikes in past and found tracks boring but cars feel more fun on track so...
And before you say 'why don't you just get a vette', they're the wrong side of the road for here and weigh a decent bit more stock for stock. I'd love one though.
Thank you, oh wise S2Ki.
Hate to create a new thread on this but have been digging into this issue over the last few years while my build is being completed, not really finding concrete info, or broken links/photos so cannot verify it as it's old. So I'd love to hear/see from those who have done it, what have you fit, is the camber close to stock - must be no more than +/- 0.5deg from stock to get the car re-certified, can always adjust after
I do not have adjustable suspension beyond usual adjustable coilovers (crappy K-sport for now until car is dialed in on track), but can/likely will in future upgrades as that's really about it left to do on the car beyond completely stripping the interior again. Sound deadening and rear interior has been taken out etc so some weight reduction performed.
This is for a caged, dry sump LS3 track car which is still road legal, thus I'd love to be able to drive it to the track. Low estimates of 460Whp and 430tq.
In future I'd like to have a second set of rims via a tow bar box mount and a few in the boot.
Requirements
- Rolling is okay
- Flares are okay but prefer to keep stock body look thus steel/blended flares at most
- Camber +/- 0.5 degrees of stock (no hellaflush 350 tyres on stupid angles etc)
- not too much tyre stretch/squash as it's not really permitted here
- As much rubber as possible especially on rear
- Prefer to not limit steering angle to accommodate
- track use so street driving mannerisms are not so important. Can always go to smaller fronts to correct railroading feel etc.
- must be at least 17" fronts due to BBK clearance (willwood 6 pot)
- Looking for something like 17x11 rear and 17x10 fronts with s2k appropriate offset
- 18" with reduced sidewall on rear has myself and my porsche racing-orientated mechanic questioning if this is even worth considering (18 rear 17 front) however availability may force this route.
- 305+ rear and 285 or more front
- the fat rear tyre look is bonus but not what I'm going for (performance above all metrics - all go and no show!)
Next problem is tyre availability/choice.....
Would love to whack 285 or more on front and 305+ on rear.
In future car will be going to either E-swap or 496/502ci, current cammed/dry sump LS3 will kill the rears as it is, so the more the merrier.
Use will be track days, would like to give time attack a go, road racing/hill climbs, targa etc and also wish to set the Honda all motor NZ 1320 record. Bit of an all rounder until I figure out what I love most. Was more of a road racer on pretty modified superbikes in past and found tracks boring but cars feel more fun on track so...
And before you say 'why don't you just get a vette', they're the wrong side of the road for here and weigh a decent bit more stock for stock. I'd love one though.
Thank you, oh wise S2Ki.
08-19-2017, 05:52 AM
#2
There are no options of 275+ tires in 17" sizes so you should go a head and start looking at 18" only. there 255/40/17, which a lot of people make. but far less 265s and 275s. 285s and up in 17" tires are rare. like two whole choices rare.
you should likely be look at some 18x9.5, 10 or 10.5 with a +40 to a +57 with the widests width. 245/255/265, always slight stretch.
rear around 18x11 or 11.5 with 305s or 295, maybe a 315 if you get enough wheel width. offsets are higher. -again, always slightly stretch the tire.
17s could be done, you would need to be ok with less tire options or less rubber. honestly i think you may be surprised how well 255s handle 400 ftlbs.
you should likely be look at some 18x9.5, 10 or 10.5 with a +40 to a +57 with the widests width. 245/255/265, always slight stretch.
rear around 18x11 or 11.5 with 305s or 295, maybe a 315 if you get enough wheel width. offsets are higher. -again, always slightly stretch the tire.
17s could be done, you would need to be ok with less tire options or less rubber. honestly i think you may be surprised how well 255s handle 400 ftlbs.
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S2KIWI (08-19-2017)
08-19-2017, 06:16 AM
#3
There are no options of 275+ tires in 17" sizes so you should go a head and start looking at 18" only. there 255/40/17, which a lot of people make. but far less 265s and 275s. 285s and up in 17" tires are rare. like two whole choices rare.
you should likely be look at some 18x9.5, 10 or 10.5 with a +40 to a +57 with the widests width. 245/255/265, always slight stretch.
rear around 18x11 or 11.5 with 305s or 295, maybe a 315 if you get enough wheel width. offsets are higher. -again, always slightly stretch the tire.
17s could be done, you would need to be ok with less tire options or less rubber. honestly i think you may be surprised how well 255s handle 400 ftlbs.
you should likely be look at some 18x9.5, 10 or 10.5 with a +40 to a +57 with the widests width. 245/255/265, always slight stretch.
rear around 18x11 or 11.5 with 305s or 295, maybe a 315 if you get enough wheel width. offsets are higher. -again, always slightly stretch the tire.
17s could be done, you would need to be ok with less tire options or less rubber. honestly i think you may be surprised how well 255s handle 400 ftlbs.
Thank you very much deception, you confirmed my fears.
Wondering if a 275/17F and 3XX/18R might be another option then, compromise a little but the lighter weight of the 17" might help steering feel/unsprung weight and it could be a bit of a wash to slightly wider 18s.. The front is the main 'fit' area I'm worried about as the rack has been moved slightly forwards with curved tie rods.
Found only six tyres in 275/40/17 but better than two for 285.. X:
https://www.tirerack.com/tires/TireS...=1&RunFlat=All
I don't doubt you that 255s can handle it pretty well (seen stock LS3 MX5s running this nicely), just it has a 3.91 rear, close ratio magnum etc so might be a bit more tail happy than other builds, gearing is only for 202mph which is exactly on the aerodynamic power/speed limit currently.
Also reason for overkill is thinking for future upgrades aka do this in one hit and do it well. Would love to take the easier route but don't want to regret it later on considering the cost isn't much different now - a 750ftlb 502 or 1000ft/lb electric motors have zero mercy lol.
Why do you say to slightly stretch tyre? Is this for fit or just handling? Have not come across this before.
Cheers and thanks again!
08-19-2017, 07:40 AM
#4
The slight stretch increases the lateral stiffness of the tire. Depending on the tire this sometimes improves the peak lateral grip of the tire but in general makes the car much more responsive in corners. This doesn't mean a tire thats 3 inches narrower than the wheel, just that you should try to stay at the upper end of the recommended wheel width range for the tire. For example a 255/45/17 RE71 recommends a 8.5-10" wheel but the 10" wheel, a 10" wheel will provide better turn in response than an 8.5" and potentially high peak grip.
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S2KIWI (08-19-2017)
08-19-2017, 02:51 PM
#5
As my prior research was all 17s, been looking around at 18"s and not many options for high offset.
wheel, offset, backspace, spacer?, tire, front or rear, forum user
18x9.5 +57 7.49" 255 front blixhavn
18x11.5 +57 295 rear blixhavn
18x10.5 +44 7.5" 285/30-18 R6 front sirbunz
18x11 +57 8.25" 295/30-18 R6 rear sirbunz
18x11 +54 8.5" 10mm 285 R6 front spaf
18x11 +59 8.5" 5mm 295 R6 rear spaf
18x11 +44 8.5" 275/30-18 R1S front ConeKiller2
18x11 +64 7.75" 275/30-18 R1S rear ConeKiller2
18x11 +51 8" 295/30-18 front rrthorne8
18x11.5 +51 8.25" 315/30-18 rear rrthorne8
18x11 15mm 275/30-18 R1S front steguis
18x11 5mm 275/30-18 R1S rear steguis
18x12 8.5" 315/30-18 rear steguis
18x11 +44 275/35-18 front iridedumped
18x11.5 +57 275/35-18 rear iridedumped
Most of the 18x11/10 setups are CCW like sirbunz and a few others. CCW is probably a little more than I want to spend as I would like to have two sets eventually. but negating any major rolling/flares would save cost so it's a little bit of a jumble.
Forgestars could be a worthy compromise though.
Heard some advans do it but can't find much on them. Also talk of Rota RT5/R doing 18x10 at high offset but can't find anything over +30 in either rotas.
Found these
Cargraphic Champion Forged Ultra-Lightweight Motorsport RG5 Wheel 18x11.5 ET44
Probably not enough offset though.
Forgestar M14 18x11.5 Modular Mesh Wheel custom offsets Pricey but could just get rears made for now and run below for fronts
Forgestar CF5 and F14 in 18x11" custom offsets
Any more suggestions highly appreciated, will keep looking.
Tyres are looking fun... lol
wheel, offset, backspace, spacer?, tire, front or rear, forum user
18x9.5 +57 7.49" 255 front blixhavn
18x11.5 +57 295 rear blixhavn
18x10.5 +44 7.5" 285/30-18 R6 front sirbunz
18x11 +57 8.25" 295/30-18 R6 rear sirbunz
18x11 +54 8.5" 10mm 285 R6 front spaf
18x11 +59 8.5" 5mm 295 R6 rear spaf
18x11 +44 8.5" 275/30-18 R1S front ConeKiller2
18x11 +64 7.75" 275/30-18 R1S rear ConeKiller2
18x11 +51 8" 295/30-18 front rrthorne8
18x11.5 +51 8.25" 315/30-18 rear rrthorne8
18x11 15mm 275/30-18 R1S front steguis
18x11 5mm 275/30-18 R1S rear steguis
18x12 8.5" 315/30-18 rear steguis
18x11 +44 275/35-18 front iridedumped
18x11.5 +57 275/35-18 rear iridedumped
Most of the 18x11/10 setups are CCW like sirbunz and a few others. CCW is probably a little more than I want to spend as I would like to have two sets eventually. but negating any major rolling/flares would save cost so it's a little bit of a jumble.
Forgestars could be a worthy compromise though.
Heard some advans do it but can't find much on them. Also talk of Rota RT5/R doing 18x10 at high offset but can't find anything over +30 in either rotas.
Found these
Cargraphic Champion Forged Ultra-Lightweight Motorsport RG5 Wheel 18x11.5 ET44
Probably not enough offset though.
Forgestar M14 18x11.5 Modular Mesh Wheel custom offsets Pricey but could just get rears made for now and run below for fronts
Forgestar CF5 and F14 in 18x11" custom offsets
Any more suggestions highly appreciated, will keep looking.
Tyres are looking fun... lol
08-19-2017, 06:20 PM
#6
I'd try to decide on a tire size first and then go from there. I'm sure you are already finding a very limited selection. I am thinking 275/35/18, 315/30/18 might be a good combo. Provided you have around +30mm outer clearance compared to stock, then you would be in the 10.5" +45, 12" +50 range.
08-20-2017, 03:06 PM
#7
Hello all,
Hate to create a new thread on this but have been digging into this issue over the last few years while my build is being completed, not really finding concrete info, or broken links/photos so cannot verify it as it's old. So I'd love to hear/see from those who have done it, what have you fit, is the camber close to stock - must be no more than +/- 0.5deg from stock to get the car re-certified, can always adjust after
I do not have adjustable suspension beyond usual adjustable coilovers (crappy K-sport for now until car is dialed in on track), but can/likely will in future upgrades as that's really about it left to do on the car beyond completely stripping the interior again. Sound deadening and rear interior has been taken out etc so some weight reduction performed.
This is for a caged, dry sump LS3 track car which is still road legal, thus I'd love to be able to drive it to the track. Low estimates of 460Whp and 430tq.
In future I'd like to have a second set of rims via a tow bar box mount and a few in the boot.
Requirements
Next problem is tyre availability/choice.....
Would love to whack 285 or more on front and 305+ on rear.
In future car will be going to either E-swap or 496/502ci, current cammed/dry sump LS3 will kill the rears as it is, so the more the merrier.
Use will be track days, would like to give time attack a go, road racing/hill climbs, targa etc and also wish to set the Honda all motor NZ 1320 record. Bit of an all rounder until I figure out what I love most. Was more of a road racer on pretty modified superbikes in past and found tracks boring but cars feel more fun on track so...
And before you say 'why don't you just get a vette', they're the wrong side of the road for here and weigh a decent bit more stock for stock. I'd love one though.
Thank you, oh wise S2Ki.
Hate to create a new thread on this but have been digging into this issue over the last few years while my build is being completed, not really finding concrete info, or broken links/photos so cannot verify it as it's old. So I'd love to hear/see from those who have done it, what have you fit, is the camber close to stock - must be no more than +/- 0.5deg from stock to get the car re-certified, can always adjust after
I do not have adjustable suspension beyond usual adjustable coilovers (crappy K-sport for now until car is dialed in on track), but can/likely will in future upgrades as that's really about it left to do on the car beyond completely stripping the interior again. Sound deadening and rear interior has been taken out etc so some weight reduction performed.
This is for a caged, dry sump LS3 track car which is still road legal, thus I'd love to be able to drive it to the track. Low estimates of 460Whp and 430tq.
In future I'd like to have a second set of rims via a tow bar box mount and a few in the boot.
Requirements
- Rolling is okay
- Flares are okay but prefer to keep stock body look thus steel/blended flares at most
- Camber +/- 0.5 degrees of stock (no hellaflush 350 tyres on stupid angles etc)
- not too much tyre stretch/squash as it's not really permitted here
- As much rubber as possible especially on rear
- Prefer to not limit steering angle to accommodate
- track use so street driving mannerisms are not so important. Can always go to smaller fronts to correct railroading feel etc.
- must be at least 17" fronts due to BBK clearance (willwood 6 pot)
- Looking for something like 17x11 rear and 17x10 fronts with s2k appropriate offset
- 18" with reduced sidewall on rear has myself and my porsche racing-orientated mechanic questioning if this is even worth considering (18 rear 17 front) however availability may force this route.
- 305+ rear and 285 or more front
- the fat rear tyre look is bonus but not what I'm going for (performance above all metrics - all go and no show!)
Next problem is tyre availability/choice.....
Would love to whack 285 or more on front and 305+ on rear.
In future car will be going to either E-swap or 496/502ci, current cammed/dry sump LS3 will kill the rears as it is, so the more the merrier.
Use will be track days, would like to give time attack a go, road racing/hill climbs, targa etc and also wish to set the Honda all motor NZ 1320 record. Bit of an all rounder until I figure out what I love most. Was more of a road racer on pretty modified superbikes in past and found tracks boring but cars feel more fun on track so...
And before you say 'why don't you just get a vette', they're the wrong side of the road for here and weigh a decent bit more stock for stock. I'd love one though.
Thank you, oh wise S2Ki.
I started out with Enkei RPF1 in the 8.5+40 convex face to accommodate future BBK and maximizing the outer fender fitment and the rear 9.5+38 - same deal, then I cut them in half and had 1.5" added to the inside of the fronts and 2" added to the rears to effectively make a 10 +58 F and 11.5 +63R.
My camber is roughly -2.3 all around on stock adjusters, with maybe 1.5" susp drop.
You wont find a lighter wheel package to run tires of these widths. You also wont be able to do it cheaper as far as replacement tires go.
This is a double duty street and road course car. Ive got maybe 100,000 miles on these wheels.
If you go with rear fender flares and more aggressive pulling up front or better yet another wider front fender, you can run the wider and stickier R comp R888 or NT01 in my sizes which is what id suggest for your power if you were to stick to 17' tire options.
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08-21-2017, 02:26 PM
#8
Im running Nitto NT05 in a 275/40/17 Front and 315/35/17 rear. These tires run on the narrower side for their section width which is why I chose them for my stock bodied S2000 - no fender flares, just some rolling/"coaxing" and bit of a pull.
I started out with Enkei RPF1 in the 8.5+40 convex face to accommodate future BBK and maximizing the outer fender fitment and the rear 9.5+38 - same deal, then I cut them in half and had 1.5" added to the inside of the fronts and 2" added to the rears to effectively make a 10 +58 F and 11.5 +63R.
My camber is roughly -2.3 all around on stock adjusters, with maybe 1.5" susp drop.
You wont find a lighter wheel package to run tires of these widths. You also wont be able to do it cheaper as far as replacement tires go.
This is a double duty street and road course car. Ive got maybe 100,000 miles on these wheels.
If you go with rear fender flares and more aggressive pulling up front or better yet another wider front fender, you can run the wider and stickier R comp R888 or NT01 in my sizes which is what id suggest for your power if you were to stick to 17' tire options.
I started out with Enkei RPF1 in the 8.5+40 convex face to accommodate future BBK and maximizing the outer fender fitment and the rear 9.5+38 - same deal, then I cut them in half and had 1.5" added to the inside of the fronts and 2" added to the rears to effectively make a 10 +58 F and 11.5 +63R.
My camber is roughly -2.3 all around on stock adjusters, with maybe 1.5" susp drop.
You wont find a lighter wheel package to run tires of these widths. You also wont be able to do it cheaper as far as replacement tires go.
This is a double duty street and road course car. Ive got maybe 100,000 miles on these wheels.
If you go with rear fender flares and more aggressive pulling up front or better yet another wider front fender, you can run the wider and stickier R comp R888 or NT01 in my sizes which is what id suggest for your power if you were to stick to 17' tire options.
Junky knows more about wide wheels with higher offsets than most of the rest of us by virtue of what he said above. RPF1s are filthy light already and widening them enables custom offsets with a little math. OP i would recommend something like this if CCW sounds a little rich.
other than that i would say if you could find any OLD set of 17x10 +60 or 17x10+70 CE28Ns or Advans (10+50) you could run some some 275/40s up front and rear. possibly find a 18x10.5 for the rear. but they don't come in high enough offsets.
08-23-2017, 03:17 AM
#9
Im running Nitto NT05 in a 275/40/17 Front and 315/35/17 rear. These tires run on the narrower side for their section width which is why I chose them for my stock bodied S2000 - no fender flares, just some rolling/"coaxing" and bit of a pull.
I started out with Enkei RPF1 in the 8.5+40 convex face to accommodate future BBK and maximizing the outer fender fitment and the rear 9.5+38 - same deal, then I cut them in half and had 1.5" added to the inside of the fronts and 2" added to the rears to effectively make a 10 +58 F and 11.5 +63R.
My camber is roughly -2.3 all around on stock adjusters, with maybe 1.5" susp drop.
You wont find a lighter wheel package to run tires of these widths. You also wont be able to do it cheaper as far as replacement tires go.
This is a double duty street and road course car. Ive got maybe 100,000 miles on these wheels.
If you go with rear fender flares and more aggressive pulling up front or better yet another wider front fender, you can run the wider and stickier R comp R888 or NT01 in my sizes which is what id suggest for your power if you were to stick to 17' tire options.
I started out with Enkei RPF1 in the 8.5+40 convex face to accommodate future BBK and maximizing the outer fender fitment and the rear 9.5+38 - same deal, then I cut them in half and had 1.5" added to the inside of the fronts and 2" added to the rears to effectively make a 10 +58 F and 11.5 +63R.
My camber is roughly -2.3 all around on stock adjusters, with maybe 1.5" susp drop.
You wont find a lighter wheel package to run tires of these widths. You also wont be able to do it cheaper as far as replacement tires go.
This is a double duty street and road course car. Ive got maybe 100,000 miles on these wheels.
If you go with rear fender flares and more aggressive pulling up front or better yet another wider front fender, you can run the wider and stickier R comp R888 or NT01 in my sizes which is what id suggest for your power if you were to stick to 17' tire options.
Local regulations - can't see anything disallowing aluminium wheels widened but neither allowing, which isn't good, only steel is allowed it seems, still waiting on response from the experts.Other issue is the 315/35/17s are only available in Australia, nothing at all here so I think will have to stick with 18s, it will get far more expensive than 18s otherwise. Oh to be in the land of the free...
Have found a local supplier of 275/35/18 Hoosier R6 and 305/645/R18 Hoosier R80 used slicks which will significantly make this more achievable and affordable. Another is Falken RT615K in 315/30/18 and Horizon but never heard of them.
Heaps of range in 295 and below though including nittos.
Decisions decisions...
Leaning towards forgestar M14 custom rears 18x11.5 in 50-60 offset and probably cheap out with some 18x10.5 F14 fronts. I notice there is a 25 dollar price difference between the 'super deep concave' and 'semi concave' versions.
https://www.vividracing.com/catalog/...151576504.html
https://www.vividracing.com/catalog/...151576483.html
I guess that makes little difference clearance wise and is more cosmetic?
Sorry for the million questions, could talk all day about superbike wheels/tyres but still learning car wheels. The rest of a car I'm reasonably well versed in though >_<
08-31-2017, 08:44 AM
#10
Thank you so very much for this rather intriguing approach, it would probably be the best way to go if not for usual legal BS complications Local regulations - can't see anything disallowing aluminium wheels widened but neither allowing, which isn't good, only steel is allowed it seems, still waiting on response from the experts.
Other issue is the 315/35/17s are only available in Australia, nothing at all here so I think will have to stick with 18s, it will get far more expensive than 18s otherwise. Oh to be in the land of the free...
Have found a local supplier of 275/35/18 Hoosier R6 and 305/645/R18 Hoosier R80 used slicks which will significantly make this more achievable and affordable. Another is Falken RT615K in 315/30/18 and Horizon but never heard of them.
Heaps of range in 295 and below though including nittos.
Decisions decisions...
Leaning towards forgestar M14 custom rears 18x11.5 in 50-60 offset and probably cheap out with some 18x10.5 F14 fronts. I notice there is a 25 dollar price difference between the 'super deep concave' and 'semi concave' versions.
https://www.vividracing.com/catalog/...151576504.html
https://www.vividracing.com/catalog/...151576483.html
I guess that makes little difference clearance wise and is more cosmetic?
Sorry for the million questions, could talk all day about superbike wheels/tyres but still learning car wheels. The rest of a car I'm reasonably well versed in though >_<
Local regulations - can't see anything disallowing aluminium wheels widened but neither allowing, which isn't good, only steel is allowed it seems, still waiting on response from the experts.Other issue is the 315/35/17s are only available in Australia, nothing at all here so I think will have to stick with 18s, it will get far more expensive than 18s otherwise. Oh to be in the land of the free...
Have found a local supplier of 275/35/18 Hoosier R6 and 305/645/R18 Hoosier R80 used slicks which will significantly make this more achievable and affordable. Another is Falken RT615K in 315/30/18 and Horizon but never heard of them.
Heaps of range in 295 and below though including nittos.
Decisions decisions...
Leaning towards forgestar M14 custom rears 18x11.5 in 50-60 offset and probably cheap out with some 18x10.5 F14 fronts. I notice there is a 25 dollar price difference between the 'super deep concave' and 'semi concave' versions.
https://www.vividracing.com/catalog/...151576504.html
https://www.vividracing.com/catalog/...151576483.html
I guess that makes little difference clearance wise and is more cosmetic?
Sorry for the million questions, could talk all day about superbike wheels/tyres but still learning car wheels. The rest of a car I'm reasonably well versed in though >_<
Hey that's why we have the forum. maybe you can recommend a good set of tires for my '07 R6, 160/180 17" i believe. need to replace the way too old of tires that are on there.
Hoosiers slicks are known for running extremely wide in 17", i would think 18s would be similar. 245/40 slicks supposed are wider than most 275/40/17 extreme performance tires. so 305s may be massive. donno for sure.
the difference of the concavity is cosmetic and clearance, the more concave version may give up some room for a big brake kit.