Energy Suspension bushing kit review
05-06-2013, 02:14 PM
#1
Energy Suspension bushing kit review
So I managed to get the car together just in time with the Energy suspension kit to take it out to Autoclub speedway and run in yesterdays S2K challenge and I figured I would post up my impressions of the setup for the rest of the R&C guys. The motivation to do the bushings was after 30+ track days and trashed compliance bushings I would be changing those regardless and I figured it would be wise to tear everything apart and put some eyeballs on it anyway.
Prior to doing the bushings I was also having issues retaining alignment settings after track days. I would set my desired -3.0 camber front and rear, 0 toe front 1/8 in rear, and almost without fail, even with no offs all day, I would previously return home with the camber somehow out of adjustment. Numerous measurements assured me it wasn't the camber joints slipping, and I had checked and re-checked sub-frame torque to ensure it wasn't moving around.
My car:
Stock class S2KC car
2005 w/ 85k miles
Eibach sway bars
SPC camber joints
OEM Suspension
Initial impressions where a crisper seat of the pants feel to the road, but not harsh. In fact when dealing with larger road bumps the suspension articulates more cleanly so it absorbs larger bumps better than with the aging OEM bushings. Steering feedback is slightly improved as well. I spent about 2-3 hours on Fri / Sat running around the San Fernando Valley (terrible roads) running errands to feel it out and not a single squeak or creak. The most noticeable difference was in controlling the rear when pavement irregularity was encountered mid corner.
So on to on-track impressions. The car became noticeably easier to drive at the limit. Under threshold braking the old squirm from heavy dynamic toe out was nearly eliminated permitting MUCH more aggressive braking and brake-pass maneuvers, where previously I would want to remain conservative, or would need to release the brake and settle the car before rotating in, after that was able to become much more fluid. This seems due to better control of the front suspension deflection but I'm no suspension engineer. While no extra speed was found through turns 1 and 2 (the banking) since it seems I'm hitting an aero wall, it did become much less intense. Previously in the banking with no aero at all the back end would squirm and wiggle with the pavement and while it would ultimately stick, it could become very unnerving. with the fresh bushings much of that was gone since most of the squirming was likely due to the right rear seeing some dynamic toe under heavy lateral G's. Finally in the infield, while ACS doesnt have a huge variety of corners, I found the car much easier to get into and control slight drifts on corner exit which would let me get on the gas MUCH sooner than before, and in turn definitely showed improvements in my speeds entering the next braking zone etc. Finally in the in-field at ACS I found that I was now able to drive over several of the curbs without upsetting the car. Previously I would need to either settle the car after going over the larger curbing. I found I was able to go right over much of it without upsetting the car too badly so there was no moment to settle the car before getting back on full throttle.
Now not everything is positive. The bushings themselves are relatively inexpensive at just under $230 for front and rear together, but of course time or labor rates can make this an expensive and involved project. Additionally during the project we found that the upper rear control arm bushings for the AP2 were missing from the kit (both AP1 and AP2 are included in the same kit), and after a quick call to the distributor they found that those same bushings were missing from ALL the in-stock kits. Energy was able to get me the necessary bushings quickly since I am close, but if you attempt this just double check your parts count first since I'm betting there are LOTS of kits out there missing these.
Overall will the bushings lead to faster lap times, maybe, but probably not directly. What they will do however is limit the number of ways the suspension can do unpredictable things and improve chassis feedback, which improves driver confidence by tons, and driver confidence will definitely lead to faster lap times. I would definitely recommend this to anyone with an older chassis or whose car has seen a significant amount of track time. The overall result is confidence inspiring and extremely street-able.
Finally re-checking alignment after the track day showed everything right where it started so whatever was moving previously isn't anymore.
Hope this helps somebody.
-Ryan
Prior to doing the bushings I was also having issues retaining alignment settings after track days. I would set my desired -3.0 camber front and rear, 0 toe front 1/8 in rear, and almost without fail, even with no offs all day, I would previously return home with the camber somehow out of adjustment. Numerous measurements assured me it wasn't the camber joints slipping, and I had checked and re-checked sub-frame torque to ensure it wasn't moving around.
My car:
Stock class S2KC car
2005 w/ 85k miles
Eibach sway bars
SPC camber joints
OEM Suspension
Initial impressions where a crisper seat of the pants feel to the road, but not harsh. In fact when dealing with larger road bumps the suspension articulates more cleanly so it absorbs larger bumps better than with the aging OEM bushings. Steering feedback is slightly improved as well. I spent about 2-3 hours on Fri / Sat running around the San Fernando Valley (terrible roads) running errands to feel it out and not a single squeak or creak. The most noticeable difference was in controlling the rear when pavement irregularity was encountered mid corner.
So on to on-track impressions. The car became noticeably easier to drive at the limit. Under threshold braking the old squirm from heavy dynamic toe out was nearly eliminated permitting MUCH more aggressive braking and brake-pass maneuvers, where previously I would want to remain conservative, or would need to release the brake and settle the car before rotating in, after that was able to become much more fluid. This seems due to better control of the front suspension deflection but I'm no suspension engineer. While no extra speed was found through turns 1 and 2 (the banking) since it seems I'm hitting an aero wall, it did become much less intense. Previously in the banking with no aero at all the back end would squirm and wiggle with the pavement and while it would ultimately stick, it could become very unnerving. with the fresh bushings much of that was gone since most of the squirming was likely due to the right rear seeing some dynamic toe under heavy lateral G's. Finally in the infield, while ACS doesnt have a huge variety of corners, I found the car much easier to get into and control slight drifts on corner exit which would let me get on the gas MUCH sooner than before, and in turn definitely showed improvements in my speeds entering the next braking zone etc. Finally in the in-field at ACS I found that I was now able to drive over several of the curbs without upsetting the car. Previously I would need to either settle the car after going over the larger curbing. I found I was able to go right over much of it without upsetting the car too badly so there was no moment to settle the car before getting back on full throttle.
Now not everything is positive. The bushings themselves are relatively inexpensive at just under $230 for front and rear together, but of course time or labor rates can make this an expensive and involved project. Additionally during the project we found that the upper rear control arm bushings for the AP2 were missing from the kit (both AP1 and AP2 are included in the same kit), and after a quick call to the distributor they found that those same bushings were missing from ALL the in-stock kits. Energy was able to get me the necessary bushings quickly since I am close, but if you attempt this just double check your parts count first since I'm betting there are LOTS of kits out there missing these.
Overall will the bushings lead to faster lap times, maybe, but probably not directly. What they will do however is limit the number of ways the suspension can do unpredictable things and improve chassis feedback, which improves driver confidence by tons, and driver confidence will definitely lead to faster lap times. I would definitely recommend this to anyone with an older chassis or whose car has seen a significant amount of track time. The overall result is confidence inspiring and extremely street-able.
Finally re-checking alignment after the track day showed everything right where it started so whatever was moving previously isn't anymore.
Hope this helps somebody.
-Ryan
05-06-2013, 04:23 PM
#2
So I managed to get the car together just in time with the Energy suspension kit to take it out to Autoclub speedway and run in yesterdays S2K challenge and I figured I would post up my impressions of the setup for the rest of the R&C guys. The motivation to do the bushings was after 30+ track days and trashed compliance bushings I would be changing those regardless and I figured it would be wise to tear everything apart and put some eyeballs on it anyway.
Prior to doing the bushings I was also having issues retaining alignment settings after track days. I would set my desired -3.0 camber front and rear, 0 toe front 1/8 in rear, and almost without fail, even with no offs all day, I would previously return home with the camber somehow out of adjustment. Numerous measurements assured me it wasn't the camber joints slipping, and I had checked and re-checked sub-frame torque to ensure it wasn't moving around.
My car:
Stock class S2KC car
2005 w/ 85k miles
Eibach sway bars
SPC camber joints
OEM Suspension
Initial impressions where a crisper seat of the pants feel to the road, but not harsh. In fact when dealing with larger road bumps the suspension articulates more cleanly so it absorbs larger bumps better than with the aging OEM bushings. Steering feedback is slightly improved as well. I spent about 2-3 hours on Fri / Sat running around the San Fernando Valley (terrible roads) running errands to feel it out and not a single squeak or creak. The most noticeable difference was in controlling the rear when pavement irregularity was encountered mid corner.
So on to on-track impressions. The car became noticeably easier to drive at the limit. Under threshold braking the old squirm from heavy dynamic toe out was nearly eliminated permitting MUCH more aggressive braking and brake-pass maneuvers, where previously I would want to remain conservative, or would need to release the brake and settle the car before rotating in, after that was able to become much more fluid. This seems due to better control of the front suspension deflection but I'm no suspension engineer. While no extra speed was found through turns 1 and 2 (the banking) since it seems I'm hitting an aero wall, it did become much less intense. Previously in the banking with no aero at all the back end would squirm and wiggle with the pavement and while it would ultimately stick, it could become very unnerving. with the fresh bushings much of that was gone since most of the squirming was likely due to the right rear seeing some dynamic toe under heavy lateral G's. Finally in the infield, while ACS doesnt have a huge variety of corners, I found the car much easier to get into and control slight drifts on corner exit which would let me get on the gas MUCH sooner than before, and in turn definitely showed improvements in my speeds entering the next braking zone etc. Finally in the in-field at ACS I found that I was now able to drive over several of the curbs without upsetting the car. Previously I would need to either settle the car after going over the larger curbing. I found I was able to go right over much of it without upsetting the car too badly so there was no moment to settle the car before getting back on full throttle.
Now not everything is positive. The bushings themselves are relatively inexpensive at just under $230 for front and rear together, but of course time or labor rates can make this an expensive and involved project. Additionally during the project we found that the upper rear control arm bushings for the AP2 were missing from the kit (both AP1 and AP2 are included in the same kit), and after a quick call to the distributor they found that those same bushings were missing from ALL the in-stock kits. Energy was able to get me the necessary bushings quickly since I am close, but if you attempt this just double check your parts count first since I'm betting there are LOTS of kits out there missing these.
Overall will the bushings lead to faster lap times, maybe, but probably not directly. What they will do however is limit the number of ways the suspension can do unpredictable things and improve chassis feedback, which improves driver confidence by tons, and driver confidence will definitely lead to faster lap times. I would definitely recommend this to anyone with an older chassis or whose car has seen a significant amount of track time. The overall result is confidence inspiring and extremely street-able.
Finally re-checking alignment after the track day showed everything right where it started so whatever was moving previously isn't anymore.
Hope this helps somebody.
-Ryan
Prior to doing the bushings I was also having issues retaining alignment settings after track days. I would set my desired -3.0 camber front and rear, 0 toe front 1/8 in rear, and almost without fail, even with no offs all day, I would previously return home with the camber somehow out of adjustment. Numerous measurements assured me it wasn't the camber joints slipping, and I had checked and re-checked sub-frame torque to ensure it wasn't moving around.
My car:
Stock class S2KC car
2005 w/ 85k miles
Eibach sway bars
SPC camber joints
OEM Suspension
Initial impressions where a crisper seat of the pants feel to the road, but not harsh. In fact when dealing with larger road bumps the suspension articulates more cleanly so it absorbs larger bumps better than with the aging OEM bushings. Steering feedback is slightly improved as well. I spent about 2-3 hours on Fri / Sat running around the San Fernando Valley (terrible roads) running errands to feel it out and not a single squeak or creak. The most noticeable difference was in controlling the rear when pavement irregularity was encountered mid corner.
So on to on-track impressions. The car became noticeably easier to drive at the limit. Under threshold braking the old squirm from heavy dynamic toe out was nearly eliminated permitting MUCH more aggressive braking and brake-pass maneuvers, where previously I would want to remain conservative, or would need to release the brake and settle the car before rotating in, after that was able to become much more fluid. This seems due to better control of the front suspension deflection but I'm no suspension engineer. While no extra speed was found through turns 1 and 2 (the banking) since it seems I'm hitting an aero wall, it did become much less intense. Previously in the banking with no aero at all the back end would squirm and wiggle with the pavement and while it would ultimately stick, it could become very unnerving. with the fresh bushings much of that was gone since most of the squirming was likely due to the right rear seeing some dynamic toe under heavy lateral G's. Finally in the infield, while ACS doesnt have a huge variety of corners, I found the car much easier to get into and control slight drifts on corner exit which would let me get on the gas MUCH sooner than before, and in turn definitely showed improvements in my speeds entering the next braking zone etc. Finally in the in-field at ACS I found that I was now able to drive over several of the curbs without upsetting the car. Previously I would need to either settle the car after going over the larger curbing. I found I was able to go right over much of it without upsetting the car too badly so there was no moment to settle the car before getting back on full throttle.
Now not everything is positive. The bushings themselves are relatively inexpensive at just under $230 for front and rear together, but of course time or labor rates can make this an expensive and involved project. Additionally during the project we found that the upper rear control arm bushings for the AP2 were missing from the kit (both AP1 and AP2 are included in the same kit), and after a quick call to the distributor they found that those same bushings were missing from ALL the in-stock kits. Energy was able to get me the necessary bushings quickly since I am close, but if you attempt this just double check your parts count first since I'm betting there are LOTS of kits out there missing these.
Overall will the bushings lead to faster lap times, maybe, but probably not directly. What they will do however is limit the number of ways the suspension can do unpredictable things and improve chassis feedback, which improves driver confidence by tons, and driver confidence will definitely lead to faster lap times. I would definitely recommend this to anyone with an older chassis or whose car has seen a significant amount of track time. The overall result is confidence inspiring and extremely street-able.
Finally re-checking alignment after the track day showed everything right where it started so whatever was moving previously isn't anymore.
Hope this helps somebody.
-Ryan
Did you consider other items such as engine mountings?
05-06-2013, 04:36 PM
#3
There is a parts manifest with the package, I believe the rear upper control arm part is 3535 (sorry working off of memory). Those were missing, and VERY different from the AP1 part. Just make sure you do a parts count before taking anything off the car. That bushing was a late change to the product when it was discovered the AP2 bushing was different, so I am betting theres a lot of packages out there without them.
Actually yes I have considered engine mounts, but I am probably going with the Megan racing engine/trans mounts since I nearly have enough gift certificates from the S2K challenge to pay for them outright.
05-07-2013, 08:43 AM
#6
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Please report back about lubrication intervals.
I'm using the powerflex bushing kit. After roughly 2000 miles of driving/auto-x, the bushings were seizing on the steel sleeves. One bushing was starting to disintegrate and had cracked through at the the start of the outer flange. I've since replaced it and will be greasing the hell out of them on a monthly or bi-monthly basis.
I'm using the powerflex bushing kit. After roughly 2000 miles of driving/auto-x, the bushings were seizing on the steel sleeves. One bushing was starting to disintegrate and had cracked through at the the start of the outer flange. I've since replaced it and will be greasing the hell out of them on a monthly or bi-monthly basis.
05-07-2013, 09:33 AM
#7
^ are the powerflex sphericals or just polyurethane with a much stiffer/harder durometer?
Similarly, what are the Energy Suspension bushings? sphericals or polyurethane?
This sounds like another great thing to add to my ever growing list of "must haves." There's something along the lines of 6 items on that list now.
Similarly, what are the Energy Suspension bushings? sphericals or polyurethane?
This sounds like another great thing to add to my ever growing list of "must haves." There's something along the lines of 6 items on that list now.
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Juan_Cheese (05-22-2018)
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05-07-2013, 09:57 AM
#8
The energy kit is poly. The compliance bushing is an interesting design where its a semi-sphere of poly that the arm swivels on (you have to sand the inside of the cup on the arm after removing the original bushing). I was skeptical at first but it definitely seems to work. Might be a frequent lubrication point though. Time will tell.
I will definitely try and update this thread as I put miles on the kit.
I will definitely try and update this thread as I put miles on the kit.
05-07-2013, 10:58 AM
#10
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Auto-x only car, driven infrequently. Might be overkill, but I don't want additional friction in the suspension system and don't want to trash any more bushings.