Car and Bike Talk Discussions and comparisons of cars and motorcycles of all makes and models.

German cars and reliablity?

Thread Tools
 
Old 09-01-2014, 09:43 PM
  #11  
Registered User
 
civdaddy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Posts: 299
Likes: 0
Received 1 Like on 1 Post
Default

I've done a few cam adjusters on audis and vws.

This consists of:
-removing cylinder head cover and all the jazz that's connected to it or in the way
-marking camshaft and removing to install cam adjuster
-install cam adjuster and put cam back in

S2000 TCT consists of:

Remove 2 bolts annd pull a pin...

I'm not a fan of German cars AT ALL.
Old 09-02-2014, 04:56 AM
  #12  
Moderator

 
Saki GT's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: Queen City, NC
Posts: 35,955
Received 197 Likes on 137 Posts
Default

Originally Posted by bruthaboost
In my super limited experience with German cars, a buddy and me were doing some routine maintenance work for a female coworker's merc. Sure, it's great when it works, but the Germans (at least Mercs) over complicate things. I remember looking at the brake pad wear indicators. Each caliper had a circuit that would trip a dash light at a certain amount of wear. Lots of other manufacturers only use a metal indicator on the pad to scrape the rotor. All that extra stuff on the caliper is just another failure point. You could see this philosophy in the entire car: added extra complexity and potential failure points.
Definitely over-engineered. Half the time there is a problem, it's with the sensor rather than the component the sensor is supposed to monitor.
Old 09-02-2014, 06:45 AM
  #13  

 
vader1's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: MAHT-O-MEDI
Posts: 11,815
Received 424 Likes on 299 Posts
Default

Originally Posted by lovegroova
Porsche have a pretty poor reliability record,

With a couple exceptions, Porsche has a fantastic reputation over the past decade. The IMS bearing failures are very overblown.

Merc had a downturn in reliability during the same period but is supposed to be on the rebound.

My only personal experience is my father put 100,000 trouble free miles on a 1996 Audi A4 and I have a 2014 3 series with 10,000 miles and not a single hiccup. Time will tell I guess on my 3 series but I think I will keep it for 80-100,000 miles.

I think the bad reputation is very inflated mainly due the the fact that parts are expensive, and many times getting them from europe is difficult making the owner spend a couple weeks in a loaner for a simple repair.

A neighbor friend of mine grew up with his father working for Chrysler and he owns a Ram 1500 with 140,000 on it and an Intrepid with 160,000. He has replaced the transmission in each of them, alternators, wheel bearings, calipers, shocks, struts, sensors of every kind, window motors, etc. At about 60,000 each became total pieces of sh*t. Both are garaged cars and both a rusting through the sheetmetal. I know this because he asks for my help all the time when doing the work. If you ask him about Chrysler reliability he will say "Excellent. These have been super reliable." He has had lots of downtime in the cars and his wife has been stranded twice in the Intrepid. But he bashes imports and is a "American-iron-only", "buy-union" guy.

Then you go surf Bimmerfest and someone who blows a headlight control modual (because the headlights move with the steering wheel) at 70,000 and costs $500 his car is a total turd.

It depends a lot on who you talk to. If BMW thought thier cars were going to just lose expensive parts every day they would not have bumper to bumper 4 year 48,000 mile warranties. I don't think the Germans match the Japanese, but they are not exactly Yugo's either.

Would I buy a used BMW with 100,000 on it? No, but I would only buy a used car with less than 30,000k from any manufacturer just because you have no idea how the PO treated it for that long and what fluid changes were done. My next targets are either a 2012 Carrera S or 2015 Cayman GTS, which I will buy used in a couple more years. I will not have any reservations about either car with low miles running up to 100,000 fairly trouble free.
Old 09-02-2014, 07:28 AM
  #14  
Registered User

 
berny2435's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Arizona
Posts: 2,380
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Default

I have a few ways to view German car quality

- the more gadgets you have to break, the more that break. So many Hondas have stood the test of time bc they are simplified economy cars. so few things can go wrong, that if something does, it's not adding onto the list of things that need repair.
- the more high-tech you go, the higher the probability things will go bad. in other words, if you keep changing the technology that you are using whether it's in manufacturing or design, the less of reliability you might have because you are starting over again instead of building/improving a base design.
- I think the germans probably tend to path their own path, create their own opportunities for added failure by reaching for the stars on too many things while they should just try for the moon and improve upon other benchmarks whether it's their own or some other companies.

I don't believe that a garage queen cars are allways destined to have lots of problems, but I would be very caucious with purchase and inspection. Some people know how to take care of cars that will sit for a while. In 2004 I purchased 100% OE 1995 MR2 turbo with 14,000 miles on it from a guy that owned like 7 cars, one being a BMW 850i. It had no mechanical issues at all and especially no motor or turbo issues. Boosted very well. Did it wear out it's original tires on the 1,200 mile drive back to my place. yes. Alignment was WAY off but it drove straight. very odd. An MR2 is not a Ferrari but I'm sure if the owner did not properly care for the car, I would have had fuel issues and at least turbo issues within the 2 years and 13,000 miles I owned it.



The only odd thing I've replaced on my 1998 BMW M3 is a rear door lock actuator. Previous owner didn't have to replace many odd things either. When looking through the service receipts for the car, probably the most annouying one things the PO went through was replacing the coolant expansion tank twice and one of the fuel pumps within like 15,000 miles of owning the car.
Old 09-02-2014, 07:31 AM
  #15  

 
WolfpackS2k's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: Raleigh, NC
Posts: 3,388
Received 266 Likes on 166 Posts
Default

Porsche consistently ranks at the top of the JD Power reliability rankings, just behind Lexus. They're also known to be some of the most reliable cars over 10 years of ownership. They got dinged pretty bad (image-wise) for the 996 engine problems, and rightfully so. Still, believing that their reliability today is no better than it was 10+ years ago would be a mistake.
Old 09-02-2014, 08:13 AM
  #16  

 
Super Nintendo Chalmers's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2014
Posts: 425
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Default

Before I got my s2k I was shopping for a 335i. I almost pulled the trigger but I keep hearing horror stories from owners about common expensive problems (HPFP, wastegates, bushings, etc.) Fast forward a few months, my girlfriends Mini Cooper S (made by BMW) shredded a serpentine belt. Found out the crank pulley disintegrated, again a common problem, and an OEM replacement was $300. In addition to that you have to have a special tool to relieve the tensioner (another $40). I did the work myself but I would be afraid to see what the labor cost would've been. She now has a check engine light which when I pull the code it's either a problem with the cat or o2 sensor. I'm about to tell her to trade that sumbitch in!
Old 09-02-2014, 08:16 AM
  #17  

 
WolfpackS2k's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: Raleigh, NC
Posts: 3,388
Received 266 Likes on 166 Posts
Default

Cats are warrantied for 8 years/100k miles. And BMW extended the warranty on those cars (for turbo related issues) up to 100k miles.

Not that what I just said excuses them.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Old 09-02-2014, 08:48 AM
  #18  

 
Super Nintendo Chalmers's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2014
Posts: 425
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Default

My bad, I should've mentioned it's an '06 with 117k miles. Honestly I'm surprised the only major thing was that pulley...as far as I know.
Old 09-02-2014, 09:03 AM
  #19  

 
TheDonEffect's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2006
Posts: 8,029
Received 491 Likes on 375 Posts
Default

The thing about it is that they're really not reinventing the wheel. People say oh well they're trying to accomplish this, but their engines aren't particularly more powerful/light/economic than alot of their competitors. People loved the E46 M3 engine but I found it to be delightfully harsh and hated the sound, yet people knock the VQ engines in Nissans. Nothing really catastrophic happens to their motors because they have a sensor monitoring every last thing so you can't unknowingly drive the engine into oblivion.
Remember german cars of the 80s and early 90s? Those parts were expensive and took forever to order, probably worse than vs now, but the reputation was in tact. You were getting a well engineered, high quality product that was indeed better than the competition.
People forgive the blatant issues with the car due to their infatuation with it, we're all guilty of this in some shape or form.
Once manufacturers understand that their consumers are buying based on name they begin to rest on their laurels. Happened to domestics in the 80s and 90s, Honda almost did it recently, and you can't tell me that Toyota still owns the edge over its competition like they did in the 90s.

Still, I want a german car, but only if I can afford one under warranty, my lust for them doesn't outweight the stress of owning one otherwise.
Old 09-02-2014, 09:35 AM
  #20  
Registered User

 
berny2435's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Arizona
Posts: 2,380
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Default

Originally Posted by TheDonEffect
People forgive the blatant issues with the car due to their infatuation with it, we're all guilty of this in some shape or form.
I definitely aggree and then they fight tooth and nail with people about how it's not an issue.

perfection is certainly hard to obtain and we all have our own opinions of what perfection is. To some, it's whatever the best looking car is for $50K that happens to be a luxury brand. To others, it's a list of 20 things and includes knowing that some flaws will have to messaged with mods or just ignored.


Quick Reply: German cars and reliablity?



All times are GMT -8. The time now is 09:45 AM.