Howdy!

I currently own an 2022 2SS 1LE and I absolutely love the car, its a track monster. But on track I get 2mpg, 3 days on a set of $1600 tires, 4 days on $600 brake pads. Last year I did 20 yrack days in a 2017 BRZ, and I wish I could do that again this yea in the camaro but I just cost way to much.

So I am considering switching back to a light car that I can time attack out and run more often. I am down to either a brz again or an s2000 but I think an s2000 might be a better platform for power upgrades?!

Thanks!

 

I have not tracked a Camaro yet but run on track with plenty of them including the FRS/BRZ. My experience is the S2k is better on a shorter track than the Camaro. Generally when we run a very short track with short straights (usually under 100mph for most cars other than very high powered ones) I have had a number of vette/camaro, etc owners come tell me there was no way they could hold with me in the tight sections and I would gain enough to hold them on the short straights. For example, there is a crossover/chicane element on that course that leads up a hill, around a corner and down a straight that is only about 1/4 mile long if that. I can stay well ahead of he bigger power cars like the camaros and vettes there since I can be pinned on the floor accelerating through that whole section while they had to lift or even brake for the chicane, so effectively my straight started two elements before the straight. The FRS/BRZ's if prepped properly though can give me more of a challenge there. On a bigger track with longer straights the power of the Camaro is harder to overcome. I was running within a few seconds of a TA2 driver in a Shelby mustang on a "normal" sized track (BIR) at an event last year and was always gaining on him in the twisty sections and then losing to him on the longer flat out straight where I was totally drag/power limited. For reference, I am basically running an STR autocross setup with a Karcepts tune (NA) so just putting down about 227 at the wheels. Keep in mind that there is no way to directly compare due to varying driver skill and while I consider myself on the faster side of the middle I do not consider myself the pointy end of the stick either.

I ran a standing start event at BIR last Sept in MN. I came in 2nd to an FRS. In talking with me he was able to get a bit more speed than me down the long "straight" (the straight is two turns but they are flat out) which contributed a lot to him beating me. I was actually surprised that he was able to pull on me down the straight, but I was running an APR wing, which keeps the back from getting light but does add a lot of drag. I should have removed the wing on the last runs to see if I could have improved but did not want to mess with it. We were not in the same class as the boosted cars and the big displacement cars of course, but we did raw time a number of them. But their pointy end drivers killed us of course (a boosted mid 90's Supra won I think and a Z06 I think was right behind him in their class).

I have autocrossed an FRS though in a few different prepped forms. They are super fun and very capable.

In terms of power adding, the issue on the S2k is that the motors are expensive and cannot be purchased new (salvage motors run over $3k all day long, sometimes $5k) so if I were wanting to add more power to mine I would kswap it which costs about the price of 2 s2k motors.

Parts are getting more and more expensive on the s2k as well and prices are climbing fast.

I would take my s2k hands down over an FRS/86/BRZ from a pure fun standpoint. However, if I were buying something right now to be a track toy I may lean towards the FRS. Less issue with the parts prices, easier to find replacement parts and you can probably get into one a lot cheaper than an s2k with mileage being the same. Also not bad having a real top on track in the case anything happens.

I will say though, I would be hard pressed thinking of another car that has brought as big a smile to my face as my s2000 on a track or autocross course. You feel very connected, the turn in response is amazing, car is light and very balanced, etc.

If you jumped on track on an S2k back to back with your Camaro I am guessing the Camaro would have you grinning a lot more on the power sections and the S2k would have you grinning more through the corners, especially when transitioning through multiple elements. Just my take though!

 

Oh as a note, in my S2k (NA with a tune) I get about 10 mpg on the track. About 26 mpg on combined street driving. So they are not super great on fuel given you are wringing them out at high rpm a lot to make power. But better than you are seeing in the Camaro. I expect consumables to be less as you mentioned. Brakes not as much better as you may be thinking since the S2k could benefit from larger brakes from the standpoint of consumables. I run stock brakes with Carbotech pads. The brakes themselves work very well, but they do go through pads on the track faster than you may expect and on some tracks people do run into a bit of fade when really flogging it. I have not run into any fade issues on the tracks I have run ,but that will be varying on the track. But even if I am buying more expensive street tires I am still spending under $1000 a set for 255's, and for the normal track day tires (cheaper and better wearing) I spend less than $800.

 

I would be wary of consistently tracking a car that is nearing the part of it's life cycle where major components are getting hard(er) to find. I would consider a Miata for track duties. If it HAD to be an S2000, I'd do as engifineer suggested and K swap it. Sell the F20 and let it fund the build.

 

I am kinda on the other side. I will track the shit outta mine lol. But if the motor goes, it will get a kswap. I had a thought of doing that now so I could sell my F20C, but it is at 157,000 miles so at this point will likely just keep running it until I need to do something. Lots of aftermarket stuff for other parts.

Some will not track them "because value going up" but I am one of those that does not care about that part. But that is a big deal to some. I just am one that feels like if it isnt used it is worthless but realize that is not the way a lot think lol.

But to the point above, yes replacement parts will be a lot easier on you with the twins (BRZ/86/FRS) and a lot easier to replace if you put it into a wall vs the s2000.

Good point on the miata as well. Honestly the NC would be a good candidate right now I think. I co-drive an ND1 for autocross and they are super capable as well but you can get the older versions for reasonable prices still. Less power but if you are thinking power mods everything will be cheaper and in those tight sections, any good driver in a Miata should be able to hold with an S2k all day long.

I have actually autocrossed an NB miata with an Ecoboost motor swapped in. Super fun to manage on an autocross course given the amount of tq that makes. But the owner has less than $6k in the entire car, swap and all and it is his track car now. On an autox course, we could smoke the tires coming out of a slow pin turn in third gear lol When I have more space I may do that project myself on one. I think there may be one or two out there so he had to figure a lot out himself so I can now take advantage of his learnings He bought the motor that came from a Fusion, which cost him $350 out of salvage.

 

All very good info thanks. I Actually think the camaro stops faster and takes corners faster than my brz did and im still on a stock staggered setup on 220tw tires. My brz was square on 100tw and Im 7 sec faster on my local 2 mile tight technical course and 12 sec faster on the 3 mile. Once I go square and put some better tires on that should eliminate some understeer and this thing will be even crazyier.

The s2k definitely from my experience has a little edge over the brz. I actually have a little video playing with an s2k CR on coils, upgraded brakes, 100tw tires and a tune and my PB was only 1.5 sec faster.

I love the brz but part of the reason I upgraded to the camaro was because I didnt have much faith in the powertrain of the brz. I would have been happy with just slapping a supercharger on it and getting an extra 100-150 hp but then your reliability goes out the window. Then I started looking at engine, trans swaps and suspension and that all adds up quite fast. The 5 year 60k mile track honored warranty was the big selling point for me on the camaro. But now it litteraly cost $1300 a track day.

So I had considered an s2k but the fact of parts and inflated cost of it does also worry me. Maybe Ill just take up shifter karts haha.

This is my PB and about 2mins in Im running with the s2k. This guy wins all the local Time attacks, real good driver.

 

Miatas are a no go for me im 6'1" just to small. I have actually never sat in an s2k, they might be to small too lol.

 

It will depend on your upper body/lower body ratio. I have friends who cannot drive a miata but can drive an s2k. One of them has a long torso so he can autocross my s2k, but only with the top down Top up his helmet would hit. But others I know are 6'1" and fit fine. I am 5'9" so do not have those issues!