Replacing an OEM S2K clucth with an organic one
06-14-2008, 01:38 PM
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Replacing an OEM S2K clucth with an organic one
Hi All!
I'm brand new to this forum and this is my 1st post. I purchased my 2005 S2K only two weeks ago and need to replace the stock clutch because it's burning up (apparently one high rpm launch by the previous owner seemed to have killed it).
Would you recommend that I go for a complete organic clutch kit rather than a standard replacement kit because other sites that I've been seeing say that "the standard clutch just fades to lifelessness after a couple of high rpm launches at the dragstrip" ?
If I fit an oganic clutch kit would this have an adverse effect on the master /slave clutch cylinders and on the diff ?
I would appreciate any advice you can give me asap as I need to replace the clutch real quick !
Cheers !
I'm brand new to this forum and this is my 1st post. I purchased my 2005 S2K only two weeks ago and need to replace the stock clutch because it's burning up (apparently one high rpm launch by the previous owner seemed to have killed it).
Would you recommend that I go for a complete organic clutch kit rather than a standard replacement kit because other sites that I've been seeing say that "the standard clutch just fades to lifelessness after a couple of high rpm launches at the dragstrip" ?
If I fit an oganic clutch kit would this have an adverse effect on the master /slave clutch cylinders and on the diff ?
I would appreciate any advice you can give me asap as I need to replace the clutch real quick !
Cheers !
06-14-2008, 09:35 PM
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Well....if you drag the car a lot, launches are tough on the car and when you drop the clutch something has to give, whether its the tires, diff, or clutch. If you get a stronger clutch it may put more stress on your diff.
While I dont drag race, I have an organic clutch w/ lightened flywheel and I like it. It does make it a little trickier to drive however (taking off from a stop requires finesse)
My advice - dont drag it, get a mild (stage 2ish package) and enjoy it for a long time.
Clutch drops really shouldnt hurt the clutch near as much as feathering it and slipping it. I see you have an AP2 - do some research on the CDV (Clutch Delay Valve), that would cause premature clutch wear if you were launching the car
While I dont drag race, I have an organic clutch w/ lightened flywheel and I like it. It does make it a little trickier to drive however (taking off from a stop requires finesse)
My advice - dont drag it, get a mild (stage 2ish package) and enjoy it for a long time.
Clutch drops really shouldnt hurt the clutch near as much as feathering it and slipping it. I see you have an AP2 - do some research on the CDV (Clutch Delay Valve), that would cause premature clutch wear if you were launching the car
06-14-2008, 11:54 PM
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Hi Nate4635 !
Many thanks for your reply. Many "words of wisdom" in it too ! Basically, I was thinking on the same lines as your recommendations. Thanks about the CDV I didn't know about this and I will make enquiries / point it out to local Honda dealership when they change the clutch for me.
Pity to get to know such a powerful car isn't so strong to handle dragstrip launches. I don't like dragging but unfortunately, here in Malta, we only have this one strip where you can "safely" give your car a good run without having the cops nab you! We use this strip because there is too much traffic here, coupled with our crappy roads, to enjoy the full potential of the car. Our roads are more suited for Abrams M1 tanks !
The previous car I owned (a little pocket-rocket modified Peugeot 106 XSI) was equipped with a Helix Autosport UK street-type organic clutch and it was very good although pedal pressure was high. This is what I intend fitting on the S2K. For my piece of mind, I am asking you again: would this type of clutch have an adverse effect on the master / slave clutch cylinders due to increased pedal pressure ? Also, you do believe that this type of clutch is better and more suitable for the S2K than the stock clutch, right ?
Best regards,
pfspeeddemon.
Many thanks for your reply. Many "words of wisdom" in it too ! Basically, I was thinking on the same lines as your recommendations. Thanks about the CDV I didn't know about this and I will make enquiries / point it out to local Honda dealership when they change the clutch for me.
Pity to get to know such a powerful car isn't so strong to handle dragstrip launches. I don't like dragging but unfortunately, here in Malta, we only have this one strip where you can "safely" give your car a good run without having the cops nab you! We use this strip because there is too much traffic here, coupled with our crappy roads, to enjoy the full potential of the car. Our roads are more suited for Abrams M1 tanks !
The previous car I owned (a little pocket-rocket modified Peugeot 106 XSI) was equipped with a Helix Autosport UK street-type organic clutch and it was very good although pedal pressure was high. This is what I intend fitting on the S2K. For my piece of mind, I am asking you again: would this type of clutch have an adverse effect on the master / slave clutch cylinders due to increased pedal pressure ? Also, you do believe that this type of clutch is better and more suitable for the S2K than the stock clutch, right ?
Best regards,
pfspeeddemon.
06-15-2008, 12:09 AM
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it shouldn't bother the hydraulic cylinders. I'm not sure why you got that idea. Better than the stock clutch? Now that's a relative question really. The stock clutch works great for me. This car was built by honda with road racing in mind, not drag racing! If you want a drag car, get something else, or plan on spending a lot of money to beef this car up. Just because you have a drag strip, doesn't mean you have to drop the clutch on launch. Start with a normal start, and then hammer it. You're not running for money, are you? Then why spend more money on clutch wear?
06-15-2008, 12:14 AM
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If you daily drive it and would like a more smoother bite, instead of a harsh bite, go stock. The flywheel on the ap2 is heavier than on the ap1, so if you would like the clutch to depress more easier, go with a lighter flywheel, ap1 flywheel 14 lbs., other aftermarket flywheels can go as low as 8 lbs., such as the Fidanza flywheel.
06-15-2008, 12:27 AM
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Thank you too for your replies Seattle2K and howardtan!
My S2K is a weekend drive only.
No ! No! Not at all interested in drag racing ! As I said : "unfortunately, here in Malta, we only have this one strip where you can "safely" give your car a good run without having the cops nab you! We use this strip because there is too much traffic here, coupled with our crappy roads, to enjoy the full potential of the car. Our roads are more suited for Abrams M1 tanks !"
No we don't drag race for money...it's just the adrenaline rush taking control of us ! LOL !
Will go with the organic clutch just for peace of mind since one auto review site said that while testing a brand new S2K "the standard clutch just fades to lifelessness after a couple of high rpm launches at the dragstrip". No other mods are evisaged.(Heck, I wouldn't even be changing the clutch if the guy who sold it to me didn't give it to me with a dud clutch !)
Thanks for the valid advice about launching the car and about the clutch master / slave cylinders and flywheels.
Best regards,
pfspeeddemon
My S2K is a weekend drive only.
No ! No! Not at all interested in drag racing ! As I said : "unfortunately, here in Malta, we only have this one strip where you can "safely" give your car a good run without having the cops nab you! We use this strip because there is too much traffic here, coupled with our crappy roads, to enjoy the full potential of the car. Our roads are more suited for Abrams M1 tanks !"
No we don't drag race for money...it's just the adrenaline rush taking control of us ! LOL !
Will go with the organic clutch just for peace of mind since one auto review site said that while testing a brand new S2K "the standard clutch just fades to lifelessness after a couple of high rpm launches at the dragstrip". No other mods are evisaged.(Heck, I wouldn't even be changing the clutch if the guy who sold it to me didn't give it to me with a dud clutch !)
Thanks for the valid advice about launching the car and about the clutch master / slave cylinders and flywheels.
Best regards,
pfspeeddemon
06-15-2008, 07:54 AM
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Not sure HOW small of a town you live in, but look into autocrossing. Its a way to push the car thats a little more within the cars natural talents 
My pedal pressure is not any different from what I can tell (but I do have the lightened flywheel)
Like most mods, this has its tradeoffs. However you seem to be aware of them seeing as you've have one in another car.
Keep in mind, talking to honda about the CDV might not be a good idea Unless you just want theory of operation, they are probably not going to advise you to remove it, or get around it as its designed to save wear and tear on the rear differential.
My pedal pressure is not any different from what I can tell (but I do have the lightened flywheel)
Like most mods, this has its tradeoffs. However you seem to be aware of them seeing as you've have one in another car.
Keep in mind, talking to honda about the CDV might not be a good idea
Unless you just want theory of operation, they are probably not going to advise you to remove it, or get around it as its designed to save wear and tear on the rear differential.
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06-15-2008, 10:04 PM
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im not an expert on clutches and the such, but i do want to clear up something that has been posted in another post.
the flywheel, no matter what weight, has no effect on how the clutch pedal feels.(how much pressure you need to move the pedal.)
the pressure plate is what affects the heaviness of the clutch pedal.
what a lightened flywheel does though, is decrease the amount of weight that the engine has to turn, thus it slightly increases RWHP.
some owners with a lighter flywheel also notice that the engine free revs faster due to the lower weight as well.
a draw back to a lighter flywheel is that it takes away a bit of momentum from the engine, making it easier to stall the motor when starting from a dead stop. this is only a minor drawback, because within a week you will have your "new launch technique" down pat and most likely wont stall the car anymore.
all that being said, i had an 8lb flywheel and a 4 puck sprung hub kevlar clutch in my prelude and absolutley loved it. one of the things about the clutch i liked is that it drove just like stock, but if you slipped it too much or it got hot and faded, once it cooled back down it was like it never happened.
hope all this helped and cleared a few things up. this post was not meant at all to insult other posters or be rude at all, but only to provide the facts as i know them.
thanks
james
the flywheel, no matter what weight, has no effect on how the clutch pedal feels.(how much pressure you need to move the pedal.)
the pressure plate is what affects the heaviness of the clutch pedal.
what a lightened flywheel does though, is decrease the amount of weight that the engine has to turn, thus it slightly increases RWHP.
some owners with a lighter flywheel also notice that the engine free revs faster due to the lower weight as well.
a draw back to a lighter flywheel is that it takes away a bit of momentum from the engine, making it easier to stall the motor when starting from a dead stop. this is only a minor drawback, because within a week you will have your "new launch technique" down pat and most likely wont stall the car anymore.
all that being said, i had an 8lb flywheel and a 4 puck sprung hub kevlar clutch in my prelude and absolutley loved it. one of the things about the clutch i liked is that it drove just like stock, but if you slipped it too much or it got hot and faded, once it cooled back down it was like it never happened.
hope all this helped and cleared a few things up. this post was not meant at all to insult other posters or be rude at all, but only to provide the facts as i know them.
thanks
james
06-16-2008, 09:29 AM
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Hey James, it a free world so don't worry ! None of us here should take offence, we are sharing our opinions / experiences and I am grateful to all of you for coming back to me.
So guys, given that bad review about S2K's stock clutches dying out after a couple of high rpm launches(see article at http://www.sportcompactcarweb.com/roadtest...000/index.html) and the fact that the previous owner claims that he only abused the OEM clutch once with a high rpm launch (and it started to play up thereafter) don't you all think that I'd be better off with a complete street-type organic clutch kit rather than OEM replacement kit ? Although I am a newbie to S2K's, I find it very hard to believe that the S2K drive-train is not strong enough to handle a street-type organic clutch. If you were in my shoes what would you do ? (i.e. would you go for the oem clutch or the street-type organic clutch ?)
Anxiously awaiting your valid contributions,
pfspeeddemon.
None of us here should take offence, we are sharing our opinions / experiences and I am grateful to all of you for coming back to me.So guys, given that bad review about S2K's stock clutches dying out after a couple of high rpm launches(see article at http://www.sportcompactcarweb.com/roadtest...000/index.html) and the fact that the previous owner claims that he only abused the OEM clutch once with a high rpm launch (and it started to play up thereafter) don't you all think that I'd be better off with a complete street-type organic clutch kit rather than OEM replacement kit ? Although I am a newbie to S2K's, I find it very hard to believe that the S2K drive-train is not strong enough to handle a street-type organic clutch. If you were in my shoes what would you do ? (i.e. would you go for the oem clutch or the street-type organic clutch ?)
Anxiously awaiting your valid contributions,
pfspeeddemon.
06-16-2008, 03:39 PM
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if it were me, id go with THIS CLUTCH KIT. its the same i had in my prelude, and it performed very well with their 8lb flywheel as well.
as far as the drive line not being able to handle the power, that depends on the driver. if you do lots of clutch dumps and put alot of stress to the drive train, its not gonna last too long. however, as long as you know how to smoothly launch the car and just in general take it easy, you should be fine with any clutch you get. that being said, you dont wanna go too far on the performance side so the car is still streetable.
hope this helps!
james
as far as the drive line not being able to handle the power, that depends on the driver. if you do lots of clutch dumps and put alot of stress to the drive train, its not gonna last too long. however, as long as you know how to smoothly launch the car and just in general take it easy, you should be fine with any clutch you get. that being said, you dont wanna go too far on the performance side so the car is still streetable.
hope this helps!
james