test drove an ap2 today
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From: La Crescenta, CA
Originally Posted by bludprix,Oct 3 2006, 07:32 AM
I have actually seen a video that compares AP1 w F20 and AP2 w F20 and a third car that was tuned to see if there is a difference. The video validated the point that the suspension is better on AP2s because the AP2 car was tracking consistently better times. They even switched the wheels and tires between the two because some speculate that this was the only difference. Even with the 16" AP1 wheels, the AP2 still clocked better times than the AP1 equipped with AP2 17 inchers. ( it was a Touge video from the Hot Version series. I know, not the highest regarded source, but a source nontheless.)
As for your "higher redline = more power" theory FormulaRedline; I guess the increased displacement and other developements mean nothing. I bet if Honda put the AP1 to the revised and more accurate SAE ratings, AP1's would not make 240 at the crank. EVERYTHING went down by about 10 horses after Honda adopted this change. Remember the new RL was first advertised for 300hp? Now it is at 290. Remember RSX-S at 210? Now it is at 200. So that would mean the F22c creates about 7 more horses than F20c, at least by that logic.
Like someone stated earlier, Honda would not make a regression w/ later model S2000s...
Don't get me wrong, I am not saying the AP2 is superior or better than AP1, I am just saying it is different. No one can deny the frenetically raw and communicative nature of the AP1. No one can say the AP2 is not smoother and subtler. I just get tired of certain AP1 owners feeling like they have to talk trash about AP2's all of the time. It makes it seem like they are secretly upset about newer models coming out. I don't think I have ever read a post where an AP2 driver was acting uppity and better than any AP1 owners, so why the continued hostility? I think the resentment is probably more subconscious than anything, but it still seeps out. (Again, this is not the case with all AP1 drivers or AP2 drivers, but it seems that way with some.)
I am not saying new is the only way to go, just be extraordinarily cautious when getting a used sports car like the S2000. I wish someone had told me that.
As for your "higher redline = more power" theory FormulaRedline; I guess the increased displacement and other developements mean nothing. I bet if Honda put the AP1 to the revised and more accurate SAE ratings, AP1's would not make 240 at the crank. EVERYTHING went down by about 10 horses after Honda adopted this change. Remember the new RL was first advertised for 300hp? Now it is at 290. Remember RSX-S at 210? Now it is at 200. So that would mean the F22c creates about 7 more horses than F20c, at least by that logic.
Like someone stated earlier, Honda would not make a regression w/ later model S2000s...
Don't get me wrong, I am not saying the AP2 is superior or better than AP1, I am just saying it is different. No one can deny the frenetically raw and communicative nature of the AP1. No one can say the AP2 is not smoother and subtler. I just get tired of certain AP1 owners feeling like they have to talk trash about AP2's all of the time. It makes it seem like they are secretly upset about newer models coming out. I don't think I have ever read a post where an AP2 driver was acting uppity and better than any AP1 owners, so why the continued hostility? I think the resentment is probably more subconscious than anything, but it still seeps out. (Again, this is not the case with all AP1 drivers or AP2 drivers, but it seems that way with some.)
I am not saying new is the only way to go, just be extraordinarily cautious when getting a used sports car like the S2000. I wish someone had told me that.
i'm glad i'm not the only s2k owner who saw that video.
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steven2k... i think he's saying "Area under the curve" as in our vtec is from approx 6000~9000, your's from 6000~8000. your torque doesn't come on that early either. its the gearing. its all preference. ap2's do handle better for a novice driver. it doesn't snap oversteer as much anymore, honda basically made the rear a lil softer and changed the cvjoints or something which COULD be swapped into ap1's if the person wanted to so it could handlle just as well (althougth body work was strengthened as well). along with the stock 245's ap2s get with 17 inch rims. -_- ap2's are greater than ap1's if you say so. i love my 03. again its all preference. we should all think our cars are the greatest. but don't bash -_- or think you're superior. cus thats pretty funny.my00 is honestly the best s2000. imo. just because its in its rawest form. 06's are just too soft IMO. its the driver experience that sells me the car. now go on saying your car's better blah blah blahb lal too many threads about this topic. i test drove a 05, 06 and 03 when buying mine. 06 was almost too quiet and civilized.. im sure i'll appreciate that when im older but im 18... loud vtec and countersteering is what gets me. i'll say that ap2's feel more stable through the turns but honestly its pretty hard to spin out in ap1 or ap2 on the streets unless you're insane. i just loved the way the stiffer felt rear end and longer vtec felt. whatever. im done.
Joined: Aug 2002
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From: St. Louis
Originally Posted by Steven2k,Oct 3 2006, 08:38 PM
its been proven the ap2 makes MORE POWER (dyno proven many times). the ap1 has more under the curve? are you kidding me?
like stated by another member, it has been proven the ap2 handels better consistently. do you have any idea what your talking about?
like stated by another member, it has been proven the ap2 handels better consistently. do you have any idea what your talking about?
I've also seen dyno numbers that ahow the peak hp in higher on the F22 than the F20. But I assume by your post that you don't have any dyno or tuning experience, nor understand what the area under the curve represents or why it's important?
The AP2 has been proven to handle better...consistently? Did you just make that up on the fly? Where is the evidence? I can produce Autocross results, in the region where I race as well as nationally, that show AP1's beating AP2's. I can also produce results that show the opposite. Is that consistent? Have you ever even raced your S2000?
Do you have any idea what you are talking about?
Or shall we do some more magazine racing?
Joined: May 2006
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From: NYC to SoCal
Originally Posted by bludprix,Oct 3 2006, 07:32 AM
I have actually seen a video that compares AP1 w F20 and AP2 w F20 and a third car that was tuned to see if there is a difference. The video validated the point that the suspension is better on AP2s because the AP2 car was tracking consistently better times. They even switched the wheels and tires between the two because some speculate that this was the only difference. Even with the 16" AP1 wheels, the AP2 still clocked better times than the AP1 equipped with AP2 17 inchers. ( it was a Touge video from the Hot Version series. I know, not the highest regarded source, but a source nontheless.)
As for your "higher redline = more power" theory FormulaRedline; I guess the increased displacement and other developements mean nothing. I bet if Honda put the AP1 to the revised and more accurate SAE ratings, AP1's would not make 240 at the crank. EVERYTHING went down by about 10 horses after Honda adopted this change. Remember the new RL was first advertised for 300hp? Now it is at 290. Remember RSX-S at 210? Now it is at 200. So that would mean the F22c creates about 7 more horses than F20c, at least by that logic.
Like someone stated earlier, Honda would not make a regression w/ later model S2000s...
Don't get me wrong, I am not saying the AP2 is superior or better than AP1, I am just saying it is different. No one can deny the frenetically raw and communicative nature of the AP1. No one can say the AP2 is not smoother and subtler. I just get tired of certain AP1 owners feeling like they have to talk trash about AP2's all of the time. It makes it seem like they are secretly upset about newer models coming out. I don't think I have ever read a post where an AP2 driver was acting uppity and better than any AP1 owners, so why the continued hostility? I think the resentment is probably more subconscious than anything, but it still seeps out. (Again, this is not the case with all AP1 drivers or AP2 drivers, but it seems that way with some.)
I am not saying new is the only way to go, just be extraordinarily cautious when getting a used sports car like the S2000. I wish someone had told me that.
As for your "higher redline = more power" theory FormulaRedline; I guess the increased displacement and other developements mean nothing. I bet if Honda put the AP1 to the revised and more accurate SAE ratings, AP1's would not make 240 at the crank. EVERYTHING went down by about 10 horses after Honda adopted this change. Remember the new RL was first advertised for 300hp? Now it is at 290. Remember RSX-S at 210? Now it is at 200. So that would mean the F22c creates about 7 more horses than F20c, at least by that logic.
Like someone stated earlier, Honda would not make a regression w/ later model S2000s...
Don't get me wrong, I am not saying the AP2 is superior or better than AP1, I am just saying it is different. No one can deny the frenetically raw and communicative nature of the AP1. No one can say the AP2 is not smoother and subtler. I just get tired of certain AP1 owners feeling like they have to talk trash about AP2's all of the time. It makes it seem like they are secretly upset about newer models coming out. I don't think I have ever read a post where an AP2 driver was acting uppity and better than any AP1 owners, so why the continued hostility? I think the resentment is probably more subconscious than anything, but it still seeps out. (Again, this is not the case with all AP1 drivers or AP2 drivers, but it seems that way with some.)
I am not saying new is the only way to go, just be extraordinarily cautious when getting a used sports car like the S2000. I wish someone had told me that.
the AP2 was a lot faster around the track vs AP1 that was apparent by not just the times but the driver of the AP1 who said the AP2 was faster.
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