32% Increase in University Tuition
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From: MAHT-O-MEDI
Originally Posted by Quick2K,Nov 19 2009, 05:29 PM
That's part of living in a society; you pay for things you may never need or use, because it's part of the social contract. All Californians benefit directly from having students learning things in the UC schools, because those students then populate jobs in the sectors that make California's economy so powerful and cutting-edge. They attract businesses which want smart, qualified professionals. They pay taxes to the state which are higher than they would if they were, as you say, putting up drywall.
There are a many examples of things that total strangers pay for even if they never use the facilities, but that's a part of being a resident of an organized state. I think there is a fundamental selfishness that infects the electorate who says "well, my son/daughter doesn't use the UC system, so why should I have to pay a cent for it?" You don't hear the same person saying "well, my son/daughter isn't incarcerated, so my tax dollars shouldn't be available for prisons." Pacifists can't earmark their federal tax dollars away from spending for the wars in Iraq and Afghanistan. All the same thing, it's just that education is prioritized below violence and security in the people's hierarchy of needs. I think that's backwards.
Quick2k
There are a many examples of things that total strangers pay for even if they never use the facilities, but that's a part of being a resident of an organized state. I think there is a fundamental selfishness that infects the electorate who says "well, my son/daughter doesn't use the UC system, so why should I have to pay a cent for it?" You don't hear the same person saying "well, my son/daughter isn't incarcerated, so my tax dollars shouldn't be available for prisons." Pacifists can't earmark their federal tax dollars away from spending for the wars in Iraq and Afghanistan. All the same thing, it's just that education is prioritized below violence and security in the people's hierarchy of needs. I think that's backwards.
Quick2k
I went to a public research university and then a private catholic college, and I can tell you the private college had higher tuition but I thought a better educational offering, and the public institution was bloated and full of waste everywhere. And it got that way because so many people thought that "public universities should be a funding priority!" and never questioned what they do with the money.
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From: San Diego
well, I disagree that public higher education is really so fundamentally different than public K-12 that you could say that it doesn't benefit everyone in the state. Assume that the UC system did not exist; the state would never have become such a dominant economic force. The taxes that UC graduates pay to the state are higher than they would pay if they were earning salaries with only a high school diploma; the benefits of that revenue flow to all Californians, via roads, bridges, public transportation, reinvestment in education, etc. etc.
Quick2k
Quick2k
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I'd normally be fine with this as I believe education of our younger generations post-high school is more important than nearly all other issues (economically related); my qualm is that I don't know how many kids going through the American collegiate system are going to take their educations seriously.
In other words, I am afraid all of this money is simply to get more kids in school so they can binge drink and **** like apes, rather than choose a career path and actually work hard towards it. But that's just me...
In other words, I am afraid all of this money is simply to get more kids in school so they can binge drink and **** like apes, rather than choose a career path and actually work hard towards it. But that's just me...
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From: San Diego
Originally Posted by C U AT 9K,Nov 19 2009, 04:05 PM
In other words, I am afraid all of this money is simply to get more kids in school so they can binge drink and **** like apes, rather than choose a career path and actually work hard towards it. But that's just me...
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From: SJC
Originally Posted by Kyushin,Nov 19 2009, 03:34 PM
Ya doesnt make any fukkin sense out here, were most obviosly the most expensive and highest taxed state in the country.
Anyway kids, it's time to run some real numbers:
With the 30%+ pay hike, CA's public schools are still priced to market. That said, the years leading up to these draconian hikes (along with draconian cuts), the UC Regents still voted themselves a pay raise. Mind you, this is a public servant's job whose pay (The president of the Board of Regents is getting paid $900K/yr.) is exceeding The Governator's ($206.5K/yr.) by A LOT. UCSF's president is getting paid $450K a year. . . nice work if you can get it.
I don't mind at all my tax money going to the actual UC and CSU schools. Cal alone has been the source of many employers in the area, and some of the best and brightest co-workers are products of UCLA, UCSD, Cal Tech, Cal Poly, and SJSU.
What's at real stake here is the fact that given that there are draconian leaps in tuition, and gigantic deductions in programs, qualified professors WILL leave, and take the grant money and graduate students with them. That greatly affects the University-as-business end, particularly with the UC system.
Versus many other government programs, the UC and CSU system has apparent short- and long-term-ordered effects on the economy.
While I'm parkin' and barkin' here: California is in the mess it is in for one simple reason: mandated funding, mandated allocation, and mandated spending. It's time to repeal the 2/3rds rule, overhaul, if not repeal, the proposition system, and restructure the tax laws. Constitutional Convention here I come. . .
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From: SJC
Originally Posted by Malloric,Nov 19 2009, 04:41 PM
Plus, just from my impressions the UC system its very much a business first, a research institution second, and an educator third.
If you want them to educate the next generation of dutiful proletariat, be my guest. However, if you want them to be the source of discourse and discovery that fuels innovation in a free market, accept the fact you're going to have to play ball.
