I went on holidays on september the 11th 2001, 5 or 6 hrs after the tragedy.
Just before leaving I posted a comment on this board expressing the fears of many people over here (Europe) : that GW Bush's reaction would be disproportionate and stupid.

Then I went to paris & to Greece.

Of course these were the most media-orientated holidays I ever spent : every day I bought The Guardian, The Independent, The Times, the International Herald Tribune, USA Today, Le Monde, Lib

 

WHY?

 

You pissed off a lot of people. As Americans, we are hurting and more than ever are intensely patriotic; for YOU to belittle our president after our country has done all it has to dig YOURS out, economicly and militarily, in the last 100 years, is ungrateful.

Frankly, I think most of us are a little surprised you're back at all. It's awfully convenient that you stirred up a HUGE beesnest and then disappear, only to come back wondering what happened. Your remarks got people so angry that the thread you refer to had to be removed.

El Tianti said it best in that thread. I can't quote it word for word, but it was something about the graves of Americans littering your "worthless" (his word) country to ensure your freedom today. Think really hard about why it is that you are free and not living under Hitler's government before you trash the United States.

In short, you were way out of line and you can take your anti-American sentiment to another location or put a lid on it entirely. It's not welcome here.

P.S. "W is not the crazy avenger we thought he was"... who is "we"? Other French owners apologized for your remarks here on the board. Think about that!

 

Hey folks, why don't we all calm down a little? There is no doubt that posting provocative statements at such a time was ill advised at best and I can see how it caused such offence. On the other hand most of the world including France feels that this was an attack not on the US alone but the whole civilised world. The way the world responds is important to all of us.

Furthermore, the fact that the US sent military help to Western Europe in the WWs is fantastic but irrelevant. It's like saying "We did really good stuff before so shut up and let us do something wrong now". It doesn't excuse anything (I'm not saying I disagree with how the USA and GW are handling this, just stating the principle). It also ignores that fact that an international coalition won both world wars. The US contribution was great but it is offensive to my countrymen and many others to suggest that America saved the world single handedly. Australia and New Zealand's losses for example were far greater per head of population in both wars than the US. There are still people in France who raise our flags every day. Every suburb and town in Australia has a monument to the war dead, and they are frighteningly numerous.

Come on people, we are all in this together. Let's try to find some unity to make good out of this horrible event.

 

Hey Le Car, why did Napoleon plant trees along all the roads in France?

Was it so Hitlers soldiers could walk in the shade.

 

Just as I was offended by Le Car's remarks, I didn't mean to rile anyone else's patriotism by unintentionally suggesting that we single handedly did anything; however, it's notable that the United States lent a considerable hand in WW I and II. If you read what I said, I simply said that without the help of the United States, France wouldn't be what it is today and suggested that Le Car show some respect not only for that, but for a nation in grief.

I still find his pot shots at our president while the dust and smoke still hung in the air in NY, DC, and PA in extremely poor taste and a reflection of his intense disrespect for Americans. I would still suggest that he keep those sentiments to himself, because I'm not the only one deeply offended by his remarks.

That said, I wish one of the administrators or moderators would reinstate the thread in question. I would love for Le Car to see what he has done.

 

With the greatest respect, that is debatable. The tide of both wars had already changed before American involvement. The contribution was great and shortened the conflict but not everyone thinks it changed the result. It certainly did change the face of Europe after WWII though, with the strong American involvement in Western Europe defining the Cold War era.

[QUOTE][B] and suggested that Le Car show some respect not only for that, but for a nation in grief.

 

[QUOTE]Originally posted by naishou
[B]
Isn't open debate a feature of free democratic society?

 

[QUOTE]Originally posted by Sondra S2K
[B]

open debate is great, and long live the differences, including those of opinion.

 

How tempted were you to say "Vive le difference!"

I would've thought you'd've known Le Car better than that. Have you seen his gaudy watch and car stereo

If you think we are far removed from this incident think again. The whole free world (and much of the not-so-free world) has shed many a tear since this tragic event. And if there's one thing Australia has shown in the last 100 years we're not afraid to get involved when freedom is threatened. Our people will also endure the repercussions of any actions taken in the war against terrorism.

Sondra: None of this changes that fact that the US is not entirely responsible for the results of WWI and WWII.

Naishou: Sondra's comments were addressed to an insensitive Frenchman about an American incident. Not including the efforts of the entire allied forces was probably for the sake of brevity and not a slight on Australia or other allied forces.