Also I must be very late to the party but has flashpro always had the "Overrun throttle opening" option to be enabled or disabled? I've had it enabled forever.. I imagine unchecking it should get of the annoying "rev hang" which keeps the throttle plate open slightly longer after lifting for emissions reasons?? I will reflash this with some throttle mapping changes and will be thrilled if this fixes the annoying rev hang!

One note on the throttle "maps.." I noticed that throttle tip in is 0%. Has anyone found that they need to add a few % on throttle tip in to not go lean? I would've sworn this shouldn't be 0, but maybe on newer cars it's 0% to run things on the lean side which is better for emissions?

 

It's been years since I've really thought about this topic, and it's also been 2 years since I've had conventional throttle body. However, when I installed the DBW ITBs, I had to reduce the max throttle opening percent to around 60%, since anything more than that would try to open the ITBs even more than 100%, which would put the ECU into limp mode.

I believe the overrun throttle opening option is a relatively new feature.

 

BTW, there are some other throttle settings that have a huge impact on rev hang, but they are not very intuitive. IIRC, its called something like throttle % vs Flow. It is basically a calibration table for the ECU to determine target throttle position based on target load level. However, changes to this table seem to throw off the whole tune.

 

Interesting gernby. I read some old threads where apparently even a "fixed" throttle setting is non-linear and the software increases the actual throttle plate opening as rpms rise (so 50% throttle at 2k rpm != 50% throttle at 8k rpm). I guess these are some of the "quirks" with hondata as it's not a true standalone, and the underlying proprietary/oem software has all sorts of different behavior.

I'm going to have to spend some time datalogging and looking at logs to see how things act. Adjusting the throttle plate to be less like an on/off switch and more progressive at higher rpms would certainly help with part throttle and throttle maintenance on track (I've also toyed with the idea of installing a stiffer spring for the gas pedal as it's quite soft imo compared to cable TB's).

There are definitely a lot of different tables that I probably would rather not screw with because like you said they affect things across the board. One of the real problems with hondata/flashpro is it seems like you might just be changing one setting, but it has ties to other parts of the software and may affect multiple things.. I'm sure honda did it for a reason, it just makes it a pita if you don't understand how one setting affects everything else (and it's not exactly documented clearly by hondata).

 

Also note that the S2000 throttle control module is not integrated into the ECU, so the changes made with the FlashPro just change the data that is sent to that module.

 

Gotcha, thx for the info. You definitely can't beat a good old throttle cable for simplicity and repeatability. Pre-DBW was certainly better as your right foot has full control of the TP and the TPS sensor tells the ECU the throttle plate position. Oh well, gotta save the planet..

 

Let me know your findings. I haven't gotten to spend nearly the time I want to on the DBW tables yet, but I was able to successfully manipulate them to get my turbo S2000 under 300 whp.

 

Will do. Jeez, you must've had to set the throttle plate to no more than ~50% (actual opening) to keep that thing under 300whp. If you got anything you'd like to share I'm all ears as well. Since the throttle plate opening varies with rpms (and who knows what else), you can't just set the throttle plate to a certain percentage in FP w/ the car off, look at the actual TP, and assume that'll be the actual throttle opening (although that probably isn't a bad start (then again maybe the FP is wise and won't open the throttle plate if rpms are zero)). If anyone has anything they'd like to share on this I'm all ears. If the throttle setting of ~66% is actually WOT that would be interesting..

 

Gernby is definitely correct in that WOT is actually around 66%. I spent an entire frustrating night trying changes between 70% and 100% and saw no changes in my logs.

 

Great thanks for that info. I might scale the table down to 75% when the pedal is set to 100%, so I can get some more partial throttle "resolution" with my right foot. I'll be curious to see how it does.

I tried Gernby's modified throttle map and while it does help in the lower rpms, it just feels odd to me as the rpms climb and the throttle plate opens more and there's a "rush" of acceleration (almost like turbo lag). Maybe if I rescale the whole table that'll fix this problem. Unchecking the "Overrun throttle" checkbox also seems to have helped throttle response substantially. It doesn't seem to "hang" at all on rev matching etc.. which almost feels odd as I'd gotten used to it, but it's nice to have "crisp" throttle response like a mechanical TB.

The car seems to be running noticeably leaner (I guess that's a good thing) with the 3.5" intake. I'll have to spend time putzing around and tweaking things but it's moving in the right direction.