Tuned my new setup S366 full race mani E85 - Chime in!
06-05-2014, 03:25 AM
#11
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now ur gonna be really mad, I made 800(well 796 to be exact) at 30 psi not 33 psi, only big difference in set ups is that I was at 10.5:1 compression, the .91 housing didn't seem to hurt me like everyones saying
06-05-2014, 04:30 PM
#14
I am running a 3" dp straight through to Apexi N1 3". This is the same muffler Neema made 816hp on which is why I got it.
Here's some more info....
1. The Dyno chart climbs strong to redline not showing signs of falling off. Doesn't "appear" to be backpressure.
2. VE in the fuel map dropped as I went up in boost. 116% VE at 20 psi and dropped to 104% VE by 26-28 psi. Odd.
3. Going from 28 to 31 psi made no additional power. Motor was heat soaked but shouldn't cause that much power loss.
4. Spool is late as hell in the chart!! Look at peak tq and its steady climb not peaking until 7500k.
5. I added timing until it lost power so I know it's not a lack of timing up top. Midrange may be able to use a deg or some but adding timing from 7500-8500 did nothing.
Here's some more info....
1. The Dyno chart climbs strong to redline not showing signs of falling off. Doesn't "appear" to be backpressure.
2. VE in the fuel map dropped as I went up in boost. 116% VE at 20 psi and dropped to 104% VE by 26-28 psi. Odd.
3. Going from 28 to 31 psi made no additional power. Motor was heat soaked but shouldn't cause that much power loss.
4. Spool is late as hell in the chart!! Look at peak tq and its steady climb not peaking until 7500k.
5. I added timing until it lost power so I know it's not a lack of timing up top. Midrange may be able to use a deg or some but adding timing from 7500-8500 did nothing.
06-05-2014, 07:21 PM
#15
Registered User
I think that's a very usable power for drag racing. Not really useful for road racing or any other racing though. I do see a little spike at 6k rpm, could be variable valve kick in, and can be easily fixed, probably. What do I know? lol
Amazing numbers on a 2800 lb car. Considering that's 756 HP at the crank (I do this because Veryron is AWD and that changes things). So if you're not some 500 lb beast, here are some numbers to consider:
Your Power to Weight ratio is: 3.7 lbs/hp (2800 lb/756 hp) (RWD) (0.27 hp/lb)
Considering Bugatti Veyron is 4.16 lbs/hp (4162 lb/1001 hp) (0.24 hp/lb) - 0-60 in 2.4 seconds 1/4 in 10.1 seconds (due to AWD - less power loss + quicker take off)
Pagani Zonda is 3.93 lbs/hp (2667 lbs/678 hp) (0.25 hp/lb)- 0-60 in 3.6 seconds 1/4 in 11.8 seconds (RWD)
2012 Nissan GTR is 7.0 lbs/hp (3829 lb/545 hp) (AWD) (0.14 hp/lb) 0-60 in 3.1 seconds 1/4 in 12.1 seconds (due to AWD - less power loss + quicker take off)
Technically, your car is faster than both Veyron and Zonda.
If you can grip, mathematically, you can do 2.23 second on 0-60 mph. But then again, Pagani Zonda can theoretically do 0-60 in 2.335 seconds...
My ideal powerband would be on S2k is something like, I hit 5500 rpm at 450 whp, then it remains flat through 9k rpm.
BUT! This is not considering how the power is used, and planned. If you considered the lag, and that your dyno numbers are spiking and peak number is 756, then you have to subtract the reaction time, 1st gear number/hp loss to get to 7k RPM (est) before you can keep your car at 7k+ RPM for the rest of the run to use the 600+ crank hp.
And of course, it's hard to get dyno maps for these $1 + cars (minus the cheap GTR - ha). But if you can get the base dyno map, you can look at it, and see how the power is dispensed.
This one is interesting: http://www.autodrome.fr/pagani_technique.htm - Pagani Zonda
But what's more interesting is this: http://media.ed.edmunds-media.com/ni...107124_600.jpg - 2012 Nissan GTR - peak at 4k RPM and flat lines until redline (sorta - tune can fix this stock)
Then again, why would these "bought, not built" guys with money ever dyno their car? They're too busy ordering their next round of expensive things to appreciate or study their car enough.
meanwhile, the engineers dies a little inside every time these non-car guys buy their life's work.
Amazing numbers on a 2800 lb car. Considering that's 756 HP at the crank (I do this because Veryron is AWD and that changes things). So if you're not some 500 lb beast, here are some numbers to consider:
Your Power to Weight ratio is: 3.7 lbs/hp (2800 lb/756 hp) (RWD) (0.27 hp/lb)
Considering Bugatti Veyron is 4.16 lbs/hp (4162 lb/1001 hp) (0.24 hp/lb) - 0-60 in 2.4 seconds 1/4 in 10.1 seconds (due to AWD - less power loss + quicker take off)
Pagani Zonda is 3.93 lbs/hp (2667 lbs/678 hp) (0.25 hp/lb)- 0-60 in 3.6 seconds 1/4 in 11.8 seconds (RWD)
2012 Nissan GTR is 7.0 lbs/hp (3829 lb/545 hp) (AWD) (0.14 hp/lb) 0-60 in 3.1 seconds 1/4 in 12.1 seconds (due to AWD - less power loss + quicker take off)
Technically, your car is faster than both Veyron and Zonda.
If you can grip, mathematically, you can do 2.23 second on 0-60 mph. But then again, Pagani Zonda can theoretically do 0-60 in 2.335 seconds...
My ideal powerband would be on S2k is something like, I hit 5500 rpm at 450 whp, then it remains flat through 9k rpm.
BUT! This is not considering how the power is used, and planned. If you considered the lag, and that your dyno numbers are spiking and peak number is 756, then you have to subtract the reaction time, 1st gear number/hp loss to get to 7k RPM (est) before you can keep your car at 7k+ RPM for the rest of the run to use the 600+ crank hp.
And of course, it's hard to get dyno maps for these $1 + cars (minus the cheap GTR - ha). But if you can get the base dyno map, you can look at it, and see how the power is dispensed.
This one is interesting: http://www.autodrome.fr/pagani_technique.htm - Pagani Zonda
But what's more interesting is this: http://media.ed.edmunds-media.com/ni...107124_600.jpg - 2012 Nissan GTR - peak at 4k RPM and flat lines until redline (sorta - tune can fix this stock)
Then again, why would these "bought, not built" guys with money ever dyno their car? They're too busy ordering their next round of expensive things to appreciate or study their car enough.
meanwhile, the engineers dies a little inside every time these non-car guys buy their life's work.
06-06-2014, 09:42 AM
#18
Registered User
I am running a 3" dp straight through to Apexi N1 3". This is the same muffler Neema made 816hp on which is why I got it.
Here's some more info....
1. The Dyno chart climbs strong to redline not showing signs of falling off. Doesn't "appear" to be backpressure.
2. VE in the fuel map dropped as I went up in boost. 116% VE at 20 psi and dropped to 104% VE by 26-28 psi. Odd.
3. Going from 28 to 31 psi made no additional power. Motor was heat soaked but shouldn't cause that much power loss.
4. Spool is late as hell in the chart!! Look at peak tq and its steady climb not peaking until 7500k.
5. I added timing until it lost power so I know it's not a lack of timing up top. Midrange may be able to use a deg or some but adding timing from 7500-8500 did nothing.
Here's some more info....
1. The Dyno chart climbs strong to redline not showing signs of falling off. Doesn't "appear" to be backpressure.
2. VE in the fuel map dropped as I went up in boost. 116% VE at 20 psi and dropped to 104% VE by 26-28 psi. Odd.
3. Going from 28 to 31 psi made no additional power. Motor was heat soaked but shouldn't cause that much power loss.
4. Spool is late as hell in the chart!! Look at peak tq and its steady climb not peaking until 7500k.
5. I added timing until it lost power so I know it's not a lack of timing up top. Midrange may be able to use a deg or some but adding timing from 7500-8500 did nothing.
How are you getting these VE numbers?
06-06-2014, 01:44 PM
#19
Registered User
Welcome to the low compression high back pressure club. The lower compression and small hot side divided mani is why you made less power than the 2.2 motor with same setup. Tony at T1 Race proved this on my divided GT35R setup on PFab mani. I had the exact same setup as joeyballs but made 200 less hp on the 1.06 divided gt35r until I swapped it out for a 1.06 nondivided hot side. Then, I was close. I had 2.0 motor with 9:1 compression while Joey had a 2.2 with stock compression. Tony said lower compression and huge overlap and high back pressure killed my numbers. Even open down pipe didn't help. Only thing that helped was when I went to a much larger hot side. Our motors cannot be choked.
06-06-2014, 02:35 PM
#20
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^^^^agreed, my low compression 2.0 motor (9:5:1) with a divided .91 lost spool and power to the open .82 on a gtx3582. our motors flow very well but with 11:1 compression, lowering it changes a lot of aspects of how it behaves and makes power, not surprised the ve on the haltech lowers as rpms rise. remember that peak ve should be when you also see peak torque so it tends to need a little less fuel as you pass that peak. I know higher compression makes more power but for a street car like mine that sees its share of pump 93 it was a sacrifice that boost can always fix.