So, I'm going to Peru for a National Tour in July and I've never driven on concrete before. People here are telling me that it's a world of difference and my car set up for asphalt will not translate well to the concrete.

Could some of you more experienced drivers give me some tips on how to better prepare my car and my self for the differences? The only tuning devices I have are a front sway bar and tire pressure. Stock shocks still live on my car.

Thanks, Matt

 

Not even on the highway? Around where I live, the highway system has a mix of concrete and asphalt.

Most people say concrete has more grip in the dry and less in the wet. That seems true to me based on highway experience. But I think it all depends on the exact mix, the size and type of the aggregate, etc.

 

Concrete is often used in sections of a corner where the cornering loads are very extreme. Concrete being harder than blacktop makes the track surface last longer. Here at The Glen the huge cornering loads of the IMSA/Grand AM cars were actually making the blacktop washboard in the corners, the concrete eliminates this issue.

The mix of the concrete and the degree it is smoothed out is, as variable as how much pepper people should put on your eggs. If someone gives you some type of blanket statement about concrete I would be very skeptical. As an example at The Glen there is concrete on many of the corners but several of them are very different in their grip potential. What you can get away with in one corner will send you right off the track in another.

 

I've been to Peru once. The grip on that concrete is incredible compared to asphalt. I wouldn't worry so much about car set up as I would about convincing yourself how much faster than normal you can run! I don't think I ever got close to the car's potential with only the 6 runs during the event. It's very wise to get there early on Friday and take advantage of the practice runs.

Don't know which swaybar you are running, but I would put it to full stiff. I've also found that I bump up my tire pressures by about 4 psi for concrete. If you haven't experienced inside wheelspin or fuel starvation, you might now. The extra grip will allow the body to roll more.

 

The local autox track up here is on an old airport with 100% concrete. There's enough grip to send 90% of FWD cars on 3 wheels. As other have mentioned it's not a night and day setup. You'll experience more grip than asphalt but it's not something you need to change your whole car for it. A good driver will be able to adapt to the changes without any problem. A good car will make the process quicker.

 

Concrete: It will tighten the car up and add more wheelspin.

Setup changes: You might need to stiffen the front bar. You also might need to use less front rebound damping.

For some cars, concrete vs. asphalt is a day vs. night thing. For the S2000, its not.

 

We did a test and tune last weekend at Grissom. The grip level is fantastic. It will take its toll on your tires though. Typically, the concrete at Grissom is very bumpy but I think I overheard Raleigh Boreen saying last week that they are working hard on designing the course around the bumpy areas so that it will be as smooth as possible.

BTW, I doubt that he will see this post but I do want to thank Raleigh and his wonderful wife Velma for all their help getting our Miata set up last weekend. These are two of the best people you could ever want to meet. They will be running the event next week at Grissom. If you do get a chance, say hi to them. You will be glad you took the time to meet such nice people.

 

Concrete is significantly grippier. As Conedodger mentions, the main difference is that you need to psych yourself up to drive into and through corners much faster than your mind, which has been programmed to drive on asphalt, thinks is possible. It can be a tough adjustment -- you'll go out, lay down what you think was an awesome run, then get whooped on by a second or two by someone with more concrete experience.

Concrete will also make your car push more. You may want to make some adjustments to loosen up your car again.

Steve

 

Please keep in mind these statements about concrete being way stickier should clearly be prefaced with WHEN IT'S DRY, as far as I'm concerned. The concrete at The Glen as an example can feel like a skating rink with even just a little rain, or sleet.

The rain line in fact is around the outside of the corner, on the blacktop, not on the concrete. At a recent school I had a guy trying to keep up with me in the rain, as many times as I went through that paticular corner way out on the outer edge (looks like the car is about to go off track or the turn-in was way too damn late and the driver is just holding on) he insisted on taking the dry line across the concrete and lap after lap I pulled away from him in that corner...

 

Wow, lots of good info guys! Thanks. I've heard that it's alot of mental adjustment. The whole how fast can you go thing. I usually go until the slip angles tell me to slow down. I hope that will be enough to push the traction envelope.