Roll bar/cages?
Thread Starter
Joined: Mar 2009
Posts: 3,664
Likes: 2
From: LO5 AN6ELE2
Roll bar/cages?
I have a few questions and concerns regarding roll bars/cages. I've tracked before (1 1/2 yrs ago) and I liked it. I'm planing on doing some autox and road racing events with ExtremeSpeed Track Events with my new ap1.I know I might get flame for not using the "search" button but didn't get much solid or creditable results. I would much rather get honest and useful info and opinion from you track guys rather then some show stopper with a show cage or jdm tyte cheap "knock off"
I thought about going with a 21 safety but opted for a welded cage. I was quoted $700 for a 4pt w/harness bar (soft top friendly) from L Con Racing. I've hear good reviews and went to his shop in Garden Groove, CA. His work looks pretty cool. Now My question is there a noticeable change or feel on handling or lateral force? Improvement on handling? Required for autox? I know the purpose of a roll cage (hence the name) is for safety in the event the car flips or rolls over but are there any other major benefits? Basically any drastic improvements?
Again my ap1 is still my daily and I have no intentions of turning it into a full track car.
Thanks in advance and sorry for the NOOB QUESTIONS 
Here's a small list of my mods if need be.
So far my suspension mods: tein flex, asm rep 4 point strut bar, and spoon lower tie bar. Engine mods are okada project coil packs, spoon style snorkel with gutted oem box
(hopefully upgrading to pswdjdm intake), toda header, spoon tp, and spoon exhaust. Tranny: unknown from previous owner. redline fluids. Aero: Cr lip, Cr wing, apr mirrors.
Wheels:re30 w/oem offset bridgestone re050a 255/40/17 235/45/17 and volk te37 w/ dunlop dirizza 101 245/40/17 225/45/17
Joined: Aug 2004
Posts: 2,742
Likes: 1
From: Hendersonville TN
I think if you want to daily drive the car a 4 point roll bar from Hard Dog is your best bet. You can bolt it in or weld it in. Best way to search is go to the home page of the racing and competition section then enter roll bar in the search area. Also, there is a FAQ in the main R & C section for this too.
Former Moderator
Joined: Aug 2004
Posts: 14,729
Likes: 8
Roll cage:
Roll bar:
It looks like you're thinking of getting a roll bar.
You also say you want to turn your car into a "full track car."
You might want to clarify what you mean by that.
There are different types of "track" events. Some are casual (HPDE). They are not competitions or "road RACING" even though some people treat them as such. ExtremeSpeed is that kind of event.
There are also time trials and wheel to wheel racing.
NASA time trials don't strictly require roll bars. All wheel to wheel racing requires roll CAGES. Some local tracks may require S2000s to upgrade their roll equipment to an SCCA legal roll bar, others allow factory equipment on some verts.
Basically, the more information you can give us about your actual track goals the better.
To answer your original question IMHO:
1. Get an SCCA-approved roll bar if you're not going wheel to wheel. Hard dog is the obvious choice, but if your local guy can build one to the SCCA rules, then that's no problem. Generally speaking, getting the Hard Dog will fit better and cost less as it's pretty much optimized to fit your soft top and the car. That's the bar most of us have.
2. One advantage are actually being able to get out on some tracks (some require it).
3. One of the main advantages for me is being able to run a full harness and HANS (head and neck safety device).
4. Performance benefit is minor. Some chassis stiffening. Roll cages have more chassis stiffening than roll bars, but I doubt you're going that route (it usually requires extensive removal of interior components like door cards).
Hope that helps and welcome to the wonderful world of motorsports!
Roll bar:
It looks like you're thinking of getting a roll bar.
You also say you want to turn your car into a "full track car."
You might want to clarify what you mean by that.
There are different types of "track" events. Some are casual (HPDE). They are not competitions or "road RACING" even though some people treat them as such. ExtremeSpeed is that kind of event.
There are also time trials and wheel to wheel racing.
NASA time trials don't strictly require roll bars. All wheel to wheel racing requires roll CAGES. Some local tracks may require S2000s to upgrade their roll equipment to an SCCA legal roll bar, others allow factory equipment on some verts.
Basically, the more information you can give us about your actual track goals the better.
To answer your original question IMHO:
1. Get an SCCA-approved roll bar if you're not going wheel to wheel. Hard dog is the obvious choice, but if your local guy can build one to the SCCA rules, then that's no problem. Generally speaking, getting the Hard Dog will fit better and cost less as it's pretty much optimized to fit your soft top and the car. That's the bar most of us have.
2. One advantage are actually being able to get out on some tracks (some require it).
3. One of the main advantages for me is being able to run a full harness and HANS (head and neck safety device).
4. Performance benefit is minor. Some chassis stiffening. Roll cages have more chassis stiffening than roll bars, but I doubt you're going that route (it usually requires extensive removal of interior components like door cards).
Hope that helps and welcome to the wonderful world of motorsports!
Former Moderator
Joined: Jul 2005
Posts: 4,634
Likes: 28
From: West Virginia
I second the Hard Dog roll bar suggestion. You won't find a better bar at anywhere near the Hard Dog price. I didn't notice a change in handling after the roll bar was installed, but the roll cage definitely stiffened the chassis and made suspension tuning more meaningful which led to much lower lap times.
Joined: Feb 2010
Posts: 3,551
Likes: 4
From: Ontario California
Were just about done with our first run of our roll bars. These are comparable to hardog bars and priced aggressively. We are socal local. Offer weld in installation and much more. Our bars are also made in spec with scca guidelines. Several s2ki members joined the group buy. We plan to sponsor so cal track events as soon as we are a bit more established
Thread Starter
Joined: Mar 2009
Posts: 3,664
Likes: 2
From: LO5 AN6ELE2
I think if you want to daily drive the car a 4 point roll bar from Hard Dog is your best bet. You can bolt it in or weld it in. Best way to search is go to the home page of the racing and competition section then enter roll bar in the search area. Also, there is a FAQ in the main R & C section for this too.
Thread Starter
Joined: Mar 2009
Posts: 3,664
Likes: 2
From: LO5 AN6ELE2
Roll cage:
Roll bar:
It looks like you're thinking of getting a roll bar.
You also say you want to turn your car into a "full track car."
You might want to clarify what you mean by that.
There are different types of "track" events. Some are casual (HPDE). They are not competitions or "road RACING" even though some people treat them as such. ExtremeSpeed is that kind of event.
There are also time trials and wheel to wheel racing.
NASA time trials don't strictly require roll bars. All wheel to wheel racing requires roll CAGES. Some local tracks may require S2000s to upgrade their roll equipment to an SCCA legal roll bar, others allow factory equipment on some verts.
Basically, the more information you can give us about your actual track goals the better.
To answer your original question IMHO:
1. Get an SCCA-approved roll bar if you're not going wheel to wheel. Hard dog is the obvious choice, but if your local guy can build one to the SCCA rules, then that's no problem. Generally speaking, getting the Hard Dog will fit better and cost less as it's pretty much optimized to fit your soft top and the car. That's the bar most of us have.
2. One advantage are actually being able to get out on some tracks (some require it).
3. One of the main advantages for me is being able to run a full harness and HANS (head and neck safety device).
4. Performance benefit is minor. Some chassis stiffening. Roll cages have more chassis stiffening than roll bars, but I doubt you're going that route (it usually requires extensive removal of interior components like door cards).
Hope that helps and welcome to the wonderful world of motorsports!
Roll bar:
It looks like you're thinking of getting a roll bar.
You also say you want to turn your car into a "full track car."
You might want to clarify what you mean by that.
There are different types of "track" events. Some are casual (HPDE). They are not competitions or "road RACING" even though some people treat them as such. ExtremeSpeed is that kind of event.
There are also time trials and wheel to wheel racing.
NASA time trials don't strictly require roll bars. All wheel to wheel racing requires roll CAGES. Some local tracks may require S2000s to upgrade their roll equipment to an SCCA legal roll bar, others allow factory equipment on some verts.
Basically, the more information you can give us about your actual track goals the better.
To answer your original question IMHO:
1. Get an SCCA-approved roll bar if you're not going wheel to wheel. Hard dog is the obvious choice, but if your local guy can build one to the SCCA rules, then that's no problem. Generally speaking, getting the Hard Dog will fit better and cost less as it's pretty much optimized to fit your soft top and the car. That's the bar most of us have.
2. One advantage are actually being able to get out on some tracks (some require it).
3. One of the main advantages for me is being able to run a full harness and HANS (head and neck safety device).
4. Performance benefit is minor. Some chassis stiffening. Roll cages have more chassis stiffening than roll bars, but I doubt you're going that route (it usually requires extensive removal of interior components like door cards).
Hope that helps and welcome to the wonderful world of motorsports!
Yeah I've heard that a lot of people like the Hardog cage. I know a local guy who used it, s2kdude and he regularly tracks his asm nfr ap2.
He (lcon) told me his roll bar/cages are scca approved. I'm in SoCal and I plan to attend streets of willow, willow springs, fontana speedway, and chuckwella valley since extreme events holds track days on these tracks. I haven't really checked out any autox events but I believe "El toro AFB" still holds these events. I guess I'll check out the scca website. Thanks.
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Thread Starter
Joined: Mar 2009
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From: LO5 AN6ELE2
I second the Hard Dog roll bar suggestion. You won't find a better bar at anywhere near the Hard Dog price. I didn't notice a change in handling after the roll bar was installed, but the roll cage definitely stiffened the chassis and made suspension tuning more meaningful which led to much lower lap times.
I guess I'll go with a rollbar. I'll post pics of the roll bar that lcon makes.
Thread Starter
Joined: Mar 2009
Posts: 3,664
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From: LO5 AN6ELE2
http://s1211.photobucket.com/albums/...62/ap1%20ver2/
PIcs of the Lcon roll barthat I'm really tempted to get...
(pics are from another member's build thread, will take down if requested)
PIcs of the Lcon roll barthat I'm really tempted to get...
(pics are from another member's build thread, will take down if requested)