I've been seeing a weird phenomenon at the track, and I wanna see what you guys have to say about it. Firstly let me tell you, I used to own an Evo 9, and when I decided to get rid of it, I was considering an S2000 ("CR" probably) along with the Evo 10 to replace it. I ended up with the X, and since it works a lot better than my 9 did, I'm set.
Anyway... I noticed at a track day I did at Fontana back in August, several S2000's spinning, and in particular one of 'em spinning every session he was on the track. Fast-forward to last Friday, and S2000's were literally spinning right and left. More than one car spun more than once, and apart from the odd '80's vintage Mustang, I don't remember seeing another kind of car doing it.
Now, while I was considering which car to get back in August/September, I spent some time on this board, and in particular this sub-forum. I don't remember reading one thread about the car having tendencies to just up and pirouette. Common sense dictates that if the car were responsible for the amount of spins I alone have seen, there'd be people lighting it up left and right, but that's not happening.
Except for the one car back at Fontana, which was driving in the red group with me, all or at least most of them I saw on Friday was while I was instructing a student in the white group, so I'm gonna venture a guess that for the most part, the "spin-ies" don't have a ton of car-control skill(s). Then again, neither did everyone else in the group driving other cars (the one I was in was a Miata-not mine)
As I wrote, I did a lot of research in this forum about the car, and pretty much everything I read was in check with what I would expect to read in the "track" section on any site. I figure since you guys have probably the most experience in the S2000 at the track, you might be able to shed some light on this subject for me. You drive the car on the track, some of you at least, probably are pretty darn good. You talk about tires, shocks, and coil-overs. You report how well you did at your last AX, but you don't report that the car rose up like a scalded-horse, and threw you off. If I've noticed a lot of it, you guys have had to of witnessed your fair-share as well. You know the car probably as well if not better than anyone else...who are these guys who keep losing control of their car(s), and why are they doing it? Does the car have a steep learning curve? Is it like a mini-van, in that a lot of people attracted to it, have no driving skills? If it were so hard to drive, wouldn't you then see a lot of S2000's put up for sale by people that it scared off?
Anyway.. I'm totally perplexed about it, and wanna see what you guys think
T.I.A

 

It is all up to the driver. The car is very neutral.

 

Quick steering ratio + short wheel base + vtak + inexperienced driver = SPIN

 

Which is the impression I got from reading what I did on here. I mean, it's rwd, like a 911, so you might see some oversteer at the limit (but IIRC, I think I read it might actually understeer a tad?). But unlike a 911, the weight's not all in the rear, and I've never read you steer an S2000 with the rear like you do a 911.
Have you personally noticed a lot of guys losing it on the track?

 

s2000's are a straight up driver's car in my opinion. you MUST know how to drive it. this car is a twitchy compared to other cars i've driven. i noticed with such cars as 350z, e46 m3 etc etc, that once the rears are telling you they are going to get loose, it give you more than enough time to react. this car doesn't have that much time. driver skills plays A HUGE roll when driven on the track. once you learn how to, it's TONS AND TONS AND TONS AND TONS of fun!

funny i was just talking to my buddy earlier about evo vs s2k on the track. we agreed that it's like comparing camera's. the evo (no offense) is like a really really good point and shoot camera. you point the car, u shoot for the gas, ur good. s2k is like a DLSR camera. don't use the settings on that camera well, pictures are crappy. don't drive the s2k well, outcome is a spin or off to the dirt.

just my opinion, of course everyone else has their own opinions on this. and yes, i know given an equally skilled driver in an evo will be waaaaay faster than in the s2k, but this thread is about car control so yea.

me personally, s2k > evo anytime.
fun factor > uber fast car

 

Thanx for the input, but I guess I need to point out, I'm not looking for a comparison of the Evo vs. the S2000. I simply was giving some background on myself, so hopefully people didn't think I was trolling. It could be a sensitive subject, but I'm confident the people that visit the "track" forum have a fair amount of experience with the car on the track, know how to control it, and may have some insight as to why some people seem to not be able to get a handle on it.

 

I think the deal is that, for some reason, the S2000 is very unforgiving. You can get a little bit out of shape and recover, but not nearly as far out of shape as most cars.

 

No.

I don't think driving an S2000 is as big a deal as those would make you believe. When the car is starting to understeer, let off the gas a little, and or take out some steering input. When it starts to oversteer, in some cases get on the gas, or counter steer, or less steering input.

I find it very intuitive to do what needs to be done when the car is giving me feedback from my driving inputs.

I do think, however, that people who have never driven a RWD car before, or don't have much track or solo II experience are tho ones who propagate these myths and give the S2000 a bad name.

You don't see mag reviews saying the car is a widow maker, so it must be the driver.

 

fastkev,
I love my s2k and I love it even more on the track. I think oukast's comments weren't meant to start a comarison thread to your original car. I think he was trying to say (and I agree with him) is that the s2k CAN be a great car on the track, but it takes a skilled driver to drive it effectively. There are some cars that anybody can drive and make look good, this car is not one of them. That being said, the car is very well balanced and I find it very predictable at its limits.

The best thing you could do is find a person who has one and see if they will let you drive the car. I find the s2k is a hit or miss car. Some love it, some hate it. I love it and wouldn't trade it for anything.

here is a video of me at the track having a blast. http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=XJ1JIxyK2Lo

edit: I spun out once when I hit dirt on the track, but other than that, I haven't seen any really lose it on the track. The car tends to oversteer just slightly, but I find that throttle input makes it very easy to manage and I find it actually makes the car perform better.

 

this will probably end up excessively long, but i feel like i can explain this pretty well.

i'm currently in the process of getting rid of my S so that I can get something cheaper to maintain and modify and afford to do more driving, so I've been driving other cars a lot lately and it's really opened my eyes some. the S was my first sports car that I did any serious driving with, so I sort of accepted that it was like other cars out there, just with the details better sorted. i went over a year on stock suspension and couldn't figure out why i spun out very regularly at autocross and a few times at the track. i just couldn't keep the car under control and didn't understand why, considering that many people consider the s2k relatively underpowered.

i've been driving a friend's boosted miata a decent amount lately and an s13 240sx a time or two, and these cars are so similar to an s2k but also completely different. they lack the razor sharp steering and suspension precision of the S, but they're way more forgiving. with the S I was always worried about keeping the rear under control. never scared of it, but i was always waiting for and anticipating the rear end stepping out, because i knew if I didn't start to catch it AS SOON as it started to step out then i was going to lose a serious amount of speed and time and the chances of spinning out were also pretty good. with the miata and 240, I can concentrate more on the other parts of performance driving and relax a little more without worrying about the rear end so much. those cars are so much easier to control that anytime the rear does start to step out you have plenty of time to catch it without losing any serious speed.

basically, the s2k is an extremely fast and capable car, but in order to drive it fast you REALLY need to know what the hell you're doing and have quick reactions. if you do, you can beat just about any other similarly ranked car and a lot of "faster" cars. if you don't, be prepared to spin out. i've spun out and embarrassed myself more times than i can begin to count, but i feel like i've learned a huge amount from driving this car and hate to get rid of it for that reason. i used to codrive with my friend with the boosted miata before i got the S and he regularly beat me with no problems. today I codrove with him for the first time in a good while and, without having driven his miata in the past few months, beat him by over half a second on a 40 second autocross course. and he's a pretty damn good driver too.

another note: after a little over a year i got rid of the stock suspension and moved up to a basic koni yellow and ground control coilover setup. this is a setup i'd recommend to anyone. it kept the basic stock handling characteristics of the car, but the different shock valving made the car sooo much more controllable. i could finally let the rear hang a little and not worry (as much) about completely losing it. this is the only aftermarket suspension i've done any performance driving on so i can't really compare it to any others. however, stock suspension is awesome for learning how to drive and there's nothing at all wrong with keeping it.