Chuck S

Any form of competition is expensive and there are always guys who will outspend you. Will you have more fun after adding a $2000 set of 17" wheels and a $1000 set of RE-71RS tires and will it even matter? Skill is the ultimate factor and the top finisher in your local autocross group can take your car as-is and post times embarrassingly faster than yours. As my Dad was known to say (and me repeat!) this isn't golf where we all know a new set of clubs every year will drop several strokes off our game -- it's us. And "practice" without training often reinforces ineffective "skills." A competitive driving course may be a better solution.

-- Chuck

Dibsen

Florida panhandle. weather can dip into the 30s but snow is rare.

Dibsen

Agree Chuck. I am trying to plan for tires for next year. I am leaning towards the Contis, I have a bead on 17" AP2 wheels, see how that goes. I am still a novice but I was only 2-3 sec off from other guys in my group on r-comps. So for me, big bucks on the tires would only come after I do some driver training.

Chuck S

Grab the set of AP2 wheels while you can. Supply is becoming more limited all the time. Look at tires next year. Spreading the cost out like this makes it seem less expensive.

Current darling streetable TW200 tire seems to be the Bridgestone RE-71RS but new tires arrive every year or two. Bridgestone upped their RE-71R (to RE-71RE?) and in 2022 to RE-71RS so mine could easily become "obsolete" long before I wear them out.

-- Chuck

bronxbomber252

I have had 3 of those 4, the RE71RS, V730, and the Conti ECS.

If you aren't trying to be at the pointy end of competition for track/autox I'd skip the RE71RS. They are expensive and short lived (though they are the fastest of the bunch. If you are trying to be at the pointy end of competition, you probably want wider wheels and tires anyway.

V730: Almost as fast as the RE71RS, much cheaper, much longer lived, and stay fast even when they get really hot on track. Affordable too. But they are pretty bad if you encounter any standing water which isn't great for a DD. Further, DDing them will heat cycle them out and cause them to be noticeably slower after 1-3 months of DD use (depending on your DD habits).

Conti ECS: Great DD/street performance tire and one of the fastest tires on track in the rain. They are amazing in the wet. They are a little pricier than the V730 but still reasonable and are also long lasting and will hold up to dry track days and autoX.

I would weigh the pros and cons of the V730 and the Conti ECS and decide which combo of pros and cons best fits your preferences and use case. I run the V730 for track and a couple weekend cruises a month and love them. If I was in your shoes, and wanted to stick to stock AP1 sizes, I would pick up a second set of AP1 wheels, put the Conti's on one and the V730s on the other, make the Conti's the DD/rain tire, and the V730 the dry track/autox tire.

Chuck S

Thanks for the real-life data!

My last two sets of tires wore pretty much proportional to their TW-ratings. 11,000 miles on TW200 and 17,000 on TW280. I'm currently only driving this car roughly 3,000 miles a year (no commuting in good weather) so even TW200 tires should be fine for 3 or 4 years. I'll be looking at tires again no sooner than 2026.

Any form of racing is PII (preoccupation with inconsequential increments). When I raced 24-foot sailboats a 10 mile race was often decided by less than a boat length. Note there are 1,200 boat length in those 10 miles so speed differences are in the 0.01 knot range. Autocross lasts 60 to 70 seconds? If so 3 or 4 seconds is a significant difference. As mentioned there are those who will significantly out spend you. (I think this is why bracket racing is popular in drag racing.)

-- Chuck

bronxbomber252

on tire wear, doing 3-5 track/autox events a year will wear out the 200’s in 2 seasons even with no street use unless you are not really pushing the car (in which case just go with the conti’s as they won’t hold you back any). 200TW tires are good for about 2 years before they are dried out enough that they are much slower and not any better than the conti’s. So if you are dead set on making the tires last 3-4 years, the 200TW options will only be faster for the first year, maybe 2 (depending on if they get heatcycled out on the street) even if you don’t wear them out. I had a set of V730’s heat cycle out from just 2 months of DD duty. That said, 3000mi a year is a weekend toy not DD duty so I would go with a 200TW tire like the V730 or RE71RS and just plan on getting a new set every other year even if they aren’t worn out as you are unlikely to heat cycle them out much quicker than that.

my S2000 lately sees around 2500-4500mi/yr plus 8-9 track days or time attacks (most on a track notorious for wear tires quickly) and my V730’s barely last 1 year before they are worn out. There was a time when it was my DD (14-18k miles per year) and I was doing competitive autox and I ran 2 sets of wheels, one with conti’s for DD/rain, one with whatever 200TW tire was fastest for autox that year. But now I just leave the V730’s on since I’m not super serious about competing anymore and they are very fast, but about 1s slower (1:30ish laps) than a RE71RS, handle heat better than any of the other fast 200TW tires which is great for track days, and last a whole season (only got about 1/2-2/3 of a season out of the faster 200TW tires), and are inexpensive (relatively).

btw. At the pointy end of autox competition, it’s not at 3-4s that becomes significant, its 0.3-0.4s. I’ve seen results occasionally be determined by hundredths or even thousandths of a second.

Dibsen

Tons of great info here! All the real world data, miles per year, heat cycles, you can’t get that from any tire web site. So thanks.

you guys have helped me make a decision. I run the autoX for fun, it’s like a car meet with some spirited driving. I had a lot of fun jumping in other people’s cars and there were some keen to ride with me. Maybe next year after I get some training (looking at SCCA starting line) and some pointers from the AutoX instructors I might look to get competitive. For now I just want to enjoy the S and the company of other like minded people.

im going to wear the Kelly’s out on 1 or 2 more events then replace them with the Conti’s in OE spec. Then I’ll either scoop up some ap2 wheels or keep a lookout for anyone in the local area selling something a little more JDM’er. I’ve always been a fan of Rays/ Volks

Bullwings

I think RS4s and RTK-615s might actually work for you. They'll definitely heat cycle out, and after 8K miles and your first 1.5yrs of driving won't be the same as the first 6months/3k miles. Both tires are known for their longevity in the 200TW category. For what you're describing, I'd pick those two over any of the four options that you posted in your original post.

mettamaker

Are you wanting to be quite competitive with your dd tire setup? If so then yeah I’d shell out the money for 17” tires and good 200tw tires. In fact you could keep your current 16” set as dd and just swap out wheels for each event. That way you dont need to unnecessarily wear your expensive tires out and you have good traction in poor weather with the dd set