My friend and I were bleeding our brakes today for a track session tomorrow (small track--Shawano--<60 mph) and we snapped off one of his studs taking the lug nut off. He has an ITR, and the stud that broke is on the front right wheel. We were wondering if it would still be safe to run at a short track tomorrow.

Also, I bled my brakes 3 times and the brake pedal is very soft. It had been firm and grabby. Now I can push it to the floor. I used the Motive brake bleeder and the first time I bled the brakes I accidentally used it at 25 psi. Motive recommends never to use more than 20 psi for risk of damaging the hydraulic system. Is there anything else that could be wrong besides the master cylinder?

Thanks for any and all replies.

 

Absolutely not, that's my opinion. You're going to put a lot of unequal stress on the remaining four, and why on earth would it be worth the possible consequences? A front wheel coming off is *not* a trivial matter. I know of an autox incident several years ago where lugs were not properly tightened on an RX7. Long story short, the wheel came off, went under the car, punctured the fuel tank, and the entire car burned to the ground. Thankfully no one was hurt.

As for the brakes, try bleeding them the old fashioned way with an assistant pumping the pedal. In my experience the Motive works fine for routine bleeds, but if there's a large amount of air in the system the pump-the-pedal method does a better job of purging the bubbles. The Motive set at proper pressure is just too slow to chase the big pockets out.

Also, I'm surprised you could get to 25psi without spewing fluid out the top of the reservoir. On german cars with a threaded reservoir the seal is good, but for Japanese cars with the universal adapter that cap is usually the limiting factor in how much pressure you can use.

Peter

 

Never. No ****ing way. And I'd never go back to run with an organization that passed a car through tech that way either.

 

First of all, that sucks. I've had it happen to me and there is not much worse than snapping a stud because it's bitch to fix and not something you can do track-side.

The correct answer is of course no, it's not a smart nor safe thing to do. You would never pass tech inspection if they do that where you are going and ads significant and uneven load to the other studs which you've got to think probably aren't that great either.

Like most people I am a hypocrite. I have driven on 4 studs in my S2000 (does the ITR have 4 or 5 studs?). It wasn't smart or safe or recommended or advisable but I did it anyway because I was feeling lucky. It was a front stud like yours. You roll the dice, you take your chances. On the other hand I was already at the track when it happened. If I had lost the stud at home before going I most likely wouldn't have gone. But I was already there, 5 hours from home, car and driver ready to go.

The brakes IMHO are a much more critical concern. If you can't get those sorted out then stay home. Again you would not pass inspection.

Given the number and severity of the issues you have I highly recommend you park it. The stud is an issue. The brakes are a major issue. Together they spell deathtrap for you and anyone unfortunate enough to be in your way.

 

ITR has 5 studs, Non-R integras are 4.

 

First of all the answer is NO!

And if you have to ask...

 

Thanks for all of the replies. We totally forgot about tech--of course he won't pass with a stud missing. So he's a no-go. I've bled my brakes 4 separate times today. 2 using the Motive Bleeder, 2 the pump-n-hold way. Still spongy. The only variable that I haven't isolated is the reservoir cap. I've been bleeding it with the cap on. Tomorrow morning I'll try with the cap off?

And if that doesn't work, it must be the cylinder and I'll take it to the Honda dealer since it's still under warranty.

Thanks again.

 

[Edit: reply below applies to 5-lug wheels; I'd fix it ASAP if you have only 3 left.]

Well, I don't think it's nearly as a big a deal as some of you guys. A missing stud is NOT the same as untorqued lugs, nor anywhere close to as dangerous. The remaining 4 lugs, properly torqued, are more than sufficient to keep the wheel on, even in track-day time-trial-type conditions. Moreover, you'll never notice any sort of imbalance since the lugs are so close to the center of mass of the rotating assembly.

Now it's obviously not ideal, and I wouldn't want to be in a competitive wheel-to-wheel race environment with a missing lug (more risk of car-to-car-contact, riding kerbs agressively, etc.). I'd also assume a car wouldn't pass a full race tech with a missing lug. But in the scheme of things, it's not a "drop everything don't make another move until you fix it" situation.

 

If one of the studs broke just removing the lugnut, how strong are the other four?

How well will the adjacent two studs fare with higher-than-usual loading due to their missing neighbor?

I've seen at least two instances where one bolt out of a set fails, then the remaining bolts in the set fail simultaneously and catastrophically.

If it were me, I wouldn't drive the car very far or fast with only four studs left, and I would replace all five studs, not just the one that broke.

 

In a pinch, running 4 lugs on an Integra type-r isn't really that bad when you consider the base Integra and civic uses the same amount of bolts but with a smaller bolt pattern.

The risk is ultimately up to you to drive the car but out of respect to others at the track, I strongly urge you don't.