I agree with you Chris, but I suspect that what Jason was referring to is the fact that, even when your gearbox is ok, if you grind as a result of driver error, Honda will most likely upgrade the gearbox. Unfortunate choice of words.

This is one of the reasons manufacturers are weary of forums like these. I don't blame them, but there is no turning back, they will just have to handle it the best they can.

 

Thanks, Luis... I only wish I had worded it like that in the first place. That was exactly my point.

 

Sorry Jason, you are full of crap when it comes to the transmission issue.

Not only have I, but hundreds of others have had to deal with the problem. I spent a year living with a defective transmission and I will not quietly accept your guesses dismissing it as driver error. If you will read the posts regarding it you will see it was a stacking tolerance problem in manufacturing that affected large number, but not all cars. All cars are not identical and to assume that any variance is always the driver is not valid.

Rather than argue I will post some of my correspondence with a Honda engineer, get out of this conversation, and be less ready to accept your

 

Jason

Let's not forget the the synchro problem is a stacking tolerance problem and therefore, by definition, will not happen on some cars. It also will not happen on some cars until temps are very high and the synchros expand past the tolerance limits.

I know what you meant to say, but some cars have this problem regardless of driver.

In fact, that night you drove me home you had a second gear grind, if I remember correctly.......

 

[QUOTE]Originally posted by Barry WY Silver/Black '01
[B][QUOTE]Originally posted by krazik
[b]There have been only THREE reported failures and by looking at the VIN's Honda has already sold nearly 3000, MY 2001 S2K's already.

 

Alright, here's the story for now, I got the car flatbedded to the dealer yesterday at about noon without any problems. However, my Honda service guy has been less than helpful in communicating with me, which is going to reflect on his dealer performance report. They managed to pull the car in the garage yesterday for an "inspection" and started it up, but of course it made that awful rattling noise again. So it wasn't one of those flukes. The mechanics pulled off the valve cover and some of the ignition wires, but couldn't see anything. Is the #4 cylinder really obvious to see? The guy then told me they had to contact the district manager for some approval thing and he would get back to me today. No call of course. I called them this afternoon again and I find out that they have to tear apart the head of the car, but still no diagnosis on what exactly happened. I asked them if they wanted me to provide some documentation on the #4 cylinder problem, but he replies with: "If that problem existed, my mechanics will know so you don't need to bring in anything." Well, it's been 2 days and no definite answer yet. I did manage to get a loaner car though because they are going to have my car for "a while." I specifically requested NO compact car or anything with a lawnmower engine.

Barry or Jason, how long did it take for them to do a full diagnosis of your cars. I already mentioned about the #4 cylinder failure to them, but they said we'll have to check it out. Was the noise in your car really obvious, was it constant or did you have to put the car in a gear? The noise coming from my car is constant, with or without throttle input. It's a really loud rattling and gets faster and faster as the motor keeps running. It cannot be driven at its current state, even when I tried to move it, the power didn't come linearly, it came in little spurts like it was choking. This isn't looking good, perhaps they'll just let me take the other yellow one in the showroom and we'll call it even?

 

Chris... I fully understand your frustration, and I understand the nature of the problem. I don't know what a 'stacking tolerance' is, nor can I be sure that email came from someone at Honda.

I'm not attacking you or anyone else with the grind issue... if you read carefully, I didn't post that ALL grind problems are driver related, I posted that some are. Even you have to admit that's true, as people have even come out of the woodwork on the #4 issue thinking they have the same problem (not you, EX... yours is obviously serious.)

What I am saying is this - It is possible that someone that is grinding 2nd gear due to driver error. The reason I even brought it up was due to the rantings of our X S2000 friend... Due to his general lack of credibility, and obvious anti-S2000 bias, I pegged him as one who didn't really have the grind but conviced himself that he had the grind after reading this board. Much like he has convinced himself that his motor would have given up had he not been smart enough to dump the car.

That's where my sentiment was directed, not at established, credible members like you. Me questioning your 1-2 grind would be like you questioning my #4 score. I would never question your experiences. I fully believe you had a problem, I'm just not convinced it's as widespread as it's made out to be.

There are times I wish I had never posted my #4 problem, and just let Honda take care of it... I feel bad for creating the paranoia that mechanical problems seem to cause. And that was my point with the 1-2 grind... while this forum allowed some people that may not have known about the fix get it done, it also created a snowball effect of people that 'think' they have the problem that then took the TSB into their dealers and got the work done. Honda just had to eat this un-necessary cost, and that's fine.

Chris, just remember that my response was directed at the ignorance of the troll, and in no way meant to question the validity of your or anyone else's actual experience with a known problem. I apologize for angering you, and if you want I will delete or edit my posts.

 

Jason,

If I were you I would edit your original post. Your exact words are "-2nd gear grind is mainly caused by driver error, and that fact notwithstanding, Honda released a service bulletin to change a part of the shift mechanism inside the tranny at their cost." To me, this certainly implies that you believe that in MOST cases the cause of the problem is driver error. If I were you I would word it in a manner such as "2nd gear grind is sometimes caused by driver error" or something to that effect if that is truly what you mean. I agree with Chris that you are coming off as somewhat arrogant on an issue that you aren't familiar with. I will also say that when this issue first surfaced I was one who believed it WAS mainly caused by driver error but with the number of people that have had this problem and especially some of the very credible people like Chris, I've had to modify my opinion.

 

Duly noted, Strike... and I will edit. Just remember, I was trying to put the smack down on mister X S2000, not trying to call out any current credible owners. I am sorry for how I responded, and I meant no disrespect to anyone.

 

Oh, and Meat... I grind 2nd often. Just lazy 1/2 dipping of the clutch bcause all 2001's have the fix from the factory.