Mugen ECU question
Registered User
Joined: Oct 2000
Posts: 6,936
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From: Austin
Greg, here's a link to a V-AFC with a general description.
http://www.nipponpower.com/electronic/fuel...apexi_vafc.html
Lips has one, but is awaiting a harness to plug into the ECU beforehand. A few others have used it as well.
Hope this helps.
http://www.nipponpower.com/electronic/fuel...apexi_vafc.html
Lips has one, but is awaiting a harness to plug into the ECU beforehand. A few others have used it as well.
Hope this helps.
Registered User
Joined: Oct 2000
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Not sure whether the ECU can control the Vtec engagement but the Mugen ECU does not change the Vtec in the S2000. So for the Mugen Ecu and vtec question, it is not an issue of whether it can or cannot but rather it is made not to temper with the Vtec. I got this from King's email and from the vague interpertation of the Japanese instructions that comes with the ECU. In King's email it also says that the fuel curve and ignition curve is changed as well. The last additional feature is speed limiter cut but is only useful to JDM specs car.
That leaves us with whether an ECU is made to handle the Vtec or is it some other componet.
That leaves us with whether an ECU is made to handle the Vtec or is it some other componet.
Registered User
Joined: Oct 2000
Posts: 1,057
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From: Fairfax
Do the search and you may find my hands on report on the Mugen ECU eons ago.
Cost is $1500. It may be little steep but this is a stand alone separate ECU and not upgraded of your own.
VTEC point and the Rev Limit stays the same as stock.
However there is slight change in fuel map and you can immediately notice the improvement over stock ECU.
The improvement is noticed easily on the low-end side.
You can mash on the gas and you will not bog like it always does from stand still and you can feel extra oomph down low. You can also observe consistent power delivery since the Mugen ECU cuts out various sensor readings that may contribute to power cutting protection when the optimum operating condition isn't met.
It is recommended that you need to be extra cautionary since some sensors are cut out and you need to invest in separately monitoring the condition of the running state with accurate gauges.
One problem and the only one is that you will lose the sole anti-theft measure, the immobilizer.
Other than that, if you can get over the fact that you will lose immobilizer this is a good stuff.
Cost is $1500. It may be little steep but this is a stand alone separate ECU and not upgraded of your own.
VTEC point and the Rev Limit stays the same as stock.
However there is slight change in fuel map and you can immediately notice the improvement over stock ECU.
The improvement is noticed easily on the low-end side.
You can mash on the gas and you will not bog like it always does from stand still and you can feel extra oomph down low. You can also observe consistent power delivery since the Mugen ECU cuts out various sensor readings that may contribute to power cutting protection when the optimum operating condition isn't met.
It is recommended that you need to be extra cautionary since some sensors are cut out and you need to invest in separately monitoring the condition of the running state with accurate gauges.
One problem and the only one is that you will lose the sole anti-theft measure, the immobilizer.
Other than that, if you can get over the fact that you will lose immobilizer this is a good stuff.
Registered User
Joined: Nov 2000
Posts: 113
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Hello All-
To answer a few questions about the Mugen ECU:
The Vtec actuation point is controlled by the ECU. Both the rev limiter and the Vtec actuation point of the Mugen ECU are exactly the same as the stock ECU.
The Mugen ECU is a direct development of Mugen's FIA N-1 race series program. Both the fuel and ignition curves on the Mugen ECU are completely remapped using Mugen's state of the art engine dynos. Yes-the same dynos used for both the Mugen and Honda F-1 engines. While we do understand that chassis dynos are easier to access and are relatively inexpensive to use, the use of an engine dyno is essential to precisely map an ECU. Chassis dyno's can give you a relative number to work with but are not repeatable from day to day or hour to hour depending on driveline loss, climate changes and tire slippage. With a completely climate controlled environment such as what Mugen has you can vary temperature, humidity, air intake temperature and any other parameter. Mugen maps the fuel and ignition curves at every 100 rpm from idle to redline for optimum torque and HP. This can mean leaning or richening the fuel curve and advancing or retarding the ignition timing depending on what the engine wants. This is extremely time consuming but is essential for precise mapping. You could never map an ECU or V-AFC as precisely using a chassis dyno. It is simply not possible..
The stock ECU also retards the ignition timing as soon as it senses air intake temperatures rises and coolant temperature rises. Retarding the ignition timing will drop up to 10 hp on the dyno. The Mugen ECU disables this system and reduces the sensitivety of the knock sensor. Mugen assumes you will be only use the highest octane fuel (92-93) available. We also recomend the use of the Mugen low-temp thermostat and hi-pressure radiator cap to help eliminate any engine temperature issues.
What does it mean in use? As Jason previously posted, our project car using a Mugen header/ehaust, Mugen ECU, and Mugen Carbon Fiber air box was consistently and significantly faster in 4th and 5th gear roll-ons than his car. We were also surprised that in 190 miles of EXTREMELY aggressive driving that the stock ECU cars were out of gas and our project car and GTR Power's car had 3-4 bars of gas remaining. More efficient fuel and ignition timing at all rpm and WOT resulted in better gas mileage.
How fast is the our car? Well, you'll have to wait for the August issue of Car&Driver for the complete road test
The Mugen ECU not inexpensive, but considering all the R&D and resources used in producing this product, we consider the price right in line.
Please feel free to call us (262-593-2800) or drop us an email if you have any further questions.
Cheers!
Scott
To answer a few questions about the Mugen ECU:
The Vtec actuation point is controlled by the ECU. Both the rev limiter and the Vtec actuation point of the Mugen ECU are exactly the same as the stock ECU.
The Mugen ECU is a direct development of Mugen's FIA N-1 race series program. Both the fuel and ignition curves on the Mugen ECU are completely remapped using Mugen's state of the art engine dynos. Yes-the same dynos used for both the Mugen and Honda F-1 engines. While we do understand that chassis dynos are easier to access and are relatively inexpensive to use, the use of an engine dyno is essential to precisely map an ECU. Chassis dyno's can give you a relative number to work with but are not repeatable from day to day or hour to hour depending on driveline loss, climate changes and tire slippage. With a completely climate controlled environment such as what Mugen has you can vary temperature, humidity, air intake temperature and any other parameter. Mugen maps the fuel and ignition curves at every 100 rpm from idle to redline for optimum torque and HP. This can mean leaning or richening the fuel curve and advancing or retarding the ignition timing depending on what the engine wants. This is extremely time consuming but is essential for precise mapping. You could never map an ECU or V-AFC as precisely using a chassis dyno. It is simply not possible..
The stock ECU also retards the ignition timing as soon as it senses air intake temperatures rises and coolant temperature rises. Retarding the ignition timing will drop up to 10 hp on the dyno. The Mugen ECU disables this system and reduces the sensitivety of the knock sensor. Mugen assumes you will be only use the highest octane fuel (92-93) available. We also recomend the use of the Mugen low-temp thermostat and hi-pressure radiator cap to help eliminate any engine temperature issues.
What does it mean in use? As Jason previously posted, our project car using a Mugen header/ehaust, Mugen ECU, and Mugen Carbon Fiber air box was consistently and significantly faster in 4th and 5th gear roll-ons than his car. We were also surprised that in 190 miles of EXTREMELY aggressive driving that the stock ECU cars were out of gas and our project car and GTR Power's car had 3-4 bars of gas remaining. More efficient fuel and ignition timing at all rpm and WOT resulted in better gas mileage.
How fast is the our car? Well, you'll have to wait for the August issue of Car&Driver for the complete road test
The Mugen ECU not inexpensive, but considering all the R&D and resources used in producing this product, we consider the price right in line.
Please feel free to call us (262-593-2800) or drop us an email if you have any further questions.
Cheers!
Scott
Banned
Joined: Oct 2000
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From: Chicago
Scott
Is the ECU tuned to be optimal for only stock (no-mod) cars or in combination with other Mugen parts?
How would the ECU work with FI? I imagine there could be problems with the introduction of a blower or turbo system.
Is the ECU tuned to be optimal for only stock (no-mod) cars or in combination with other Mugen parts?
How would the ECU work with FI? I imagine there could be problems with the introduction of a blower or turbo system.
Registered User
Joined: Nov 2000
Posts: 113
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Meat-
We have found the Mugen ECU to be most effective on cars equipped with the Mugen header/exhaust/intake, but we have had good results with unmodified cars too, such as our SCCA T-2 S2000.
I would not recommned using this ECU for any forced induction S2000's
Cheers!
We have found the Mugen ECU to be most effective on cars equipped with the Mugen header/exhaust/intake, but we have had good results with unmodified cars too, such as our SCCA T-2 S2000.
I would not recommned using this ECU for any forced induction S2000's
Cheers!
Registered User
Joined: Oct 2000
Posts: 968
Likes: 0
From: Port Washington
I found when sampling my Supercharged car's exhaust with the Mugen ECU, the air/fuel ratio was a little high and therefore running lean... I have replaced my stock ECU and have noticed more low-end bogging. So the Mugen ECU definitely increases around-town drivability.
