[QUOTE]Originally posted by RED MX5

 

Well, neither. Did you read my first post in this thread?

I'll try to clarify. When it comes to sliding around in a controlled manner, like when sliding almost all the way through an autocross course (not the fastest way, but lots of fun), the task is easier in the S2000 than in any other non race car that I've driven. It gives the driver good feedback, and responds quickly to small driver inputs, even when in a controlled slide. HOWEVER (as I tried to explain in my earlier post), the transition between a controlled slide and an uncontrolled slide can be sudden, and when the S2000 goes, all the driver can usually do is go along for the ride. One could see that as making it difficult to drift, but as the car is a very natural drifter, so it's easy, up until the point where you loose it. With practice, loosing it gets pretty rare.

Did you look at the video that was posted above? Doing that in a stock S2000 is very easy, but not something one should try to learn to do on the street.

I know little about drifting competition (as I also said in my first post), but look at the video, and you'll see how easy it is to throw the tail and hold it out there. You can control the angle easily with the throttle, but you have to stay in VTEC. I think if I were going to compete in the drifting comps, I'd probably fit same-size, but harder compound rear tires, and a fatter rear anti-sway bar, but I'm not sure it's needed. I should think that a car with gobs of torque and a flatter power band would be a better choice for drifting comps, because the S2000 keeps you pretty busy. That doesn't make it hard; if anything, it just makes it more fun. IMHO.

RED MX5

(edit) PS. When I took delivery my S2000, it was actually a pretty foul handling beast. Tuning tire pressures and alignment using a pyrometer (and the seat of my pants) made a world of difference. I'm stock, except for an AEM intake and British alignment. OEM S02's. On the autocross courses I'm running 36 front, and 35 rear, to get slightly MORE oversteer (because I enjoy sliding the car around too much to worry about times).

RM

 

Dori Dori say S2000 drifto OK!

 

To those that say it's difficult to drift, I don't think you understand what is required to drift.

Most mention lack of torque to bring the tail back. That's retarded. You don't need torque to bring the tail back.

Bringing the tail back requires timely counter steer and gentle throttle.

KEEPING the car in drift requires the ability to continue to keep the wheels spinning. This does require adequate power to break traction at will. For the S2000, this means being about 6000 rpm.

In trying to keep the revolutions high, the driver may push the throttle too far, thereby causing the wheels to spin too much, resulting in the car coming around.

So, competing for the longest drifts MAY be difficult given the S2000s narrow power band but drifting itself is not affected by its level of torque.

The S2000's ability to recover, however, is in no way inhibited by its torque.

 

[QUOTE]Originally posted by SAIYAJIN
To those that say it's difficult to drift, I don't think you understand what is required to drift.

 

Hi Spdlmtna,

I agree with SAIYAJIN 100%. You question is a little bit tougher, at least for me (someone else might have a better answer). The way my car is set up (I covered this in a PS to an earlier post in this thread), it doesn't tend to do 180 degree spins. Perhaps that's the driver more than the setup. I'm not really sure. I can really only speak for myself, but I instinctively counter-steer when the rear of a car starts to come around, and I think most people react the same way. Anyway, my car tends to swing the tail out almost exactly 90 degrees, and then just slide sideways until it stops. I had a very nice spin on the autocross course today and tried to do a 360 so I could just keep going. I use to get away with that sometimes in my MGA, and the S2000 can probably do it too, but I didn't quite pull it off. I spun because I got on the gas too hard coming out of the corner; my intent was to swing the tail out (for grins, not a fast time), and a switch-back transition got me. As soon as I felt the weight of the car shift I new it was going to come around, so for grins I nailed it, and since I was in VTEC, the tires (quite literally) went up in smoke. The car only pivoted about 270 degrees; it just didn't want to spin the full 360.

If the back end starts to come around, because you've hit a slick spot or over done it a little too much, and you get off the gas suddenly, it will make the spin worse. Weight shifts to the front tires when you lift throttle, resulting in LESS traction in the rear. I'm not sure (haven't tried it, and probably won't) but I think if the tail comes out hard enough to reach the point of no return (the point where you can no longer correct the spin), and you lift off the gas entirely, to jam on the brakes ... Well, I think the car will already have enough rotational inertia to continue the spin. Once you go past the point where you can correct with steering and throttle, all four tires are usually sliding, more or less sideways.

I've got a question for everyone. Does YOUR S2000 tend to go tail first (180-degree spin) or does it just get sideways, and then slide (like an F1 car). I'm not really sure how much my alignment and tire pressures affect the car after I've totally thrown it away, and I'm not sure how much my counter-steering might be limiting the spin (to less than 180). Is anyone actually having problems with 180-degree spins (where you end up going backwards)? Most of the crashes I've seen look like most of the cars leave the road traveling sideways, not backwards, and I'm positive that my car goes off course sideways (when I totally blow it).

My first attempt at making in-car autocross videos was pretty much a bust. It's actually pretty hard to tell when the tail wags by looking at the in-car video, but I did come away with two short clips where you can clearly tell that the back end is coming around, because you can see the horizon swing past and back, and my hands spin the steering wheel (at a pace that amazed me when I looked at the video) as I counter-steer to correct. You can also tell how much throttle is being applied, because the camcorder picked up the AEM intake noise quite well (in spite of too much wind noise in most of the video). If anyone wants to see the clips, PM me an e-mail address, and let me know if you want .rm, .wmv, or .mpg format. Even the .mpg video is less than 2 meg, so I can e-mail it if there aren't too many requests. The video is pretty crappy, but if anyone wants to host it, PM me, and we'll work something out.

Spdlmtna, the best way I know to learn to control a car in a slide is to get out on an autocross and slide the car around. It

 

Help, I can't stop watching it. That's insane. Homeboy can drive!

 

I wish the video was longer.

 

[QUOTE]Originally posted by spdlmtna

 

Thanks RED MX5 and Legal Bill... that information has def. convinced me to finally go to the track and try it out. I know not to let off throttle while in the middle of a turn, and also not to push it further... but, rather, to just maintain engine speed... I def. didnt know that applying brakes wouldnt help in stopping a car during a spin... I just worry about safety for myself and my S during a drive where oversteer is possibly an issue