even if jesus himself said the ap2 is better?

https://www.s2ki.com/forums/index.php?showt...&#entry11415462

i had 00 gts 6spd and i can say that both cars shifted very different. i can't describe the difference unless i show or talk to you but if you were to look shifter from the side at eye level the celica shifter would look like this from 1st to 2nd \ / whereas the S2k shifter would be l l. also when you look at it from eye level from the rear 1st 3rd and 5th would look like \l/ with the S l l l. i can't say its due to the S being rwd and the celica fwd because my is300 was the same as the celica. maybe its a toyota-honda thing....

 

I did the 3-2nd shift today, but I was only going 25-30 It just woke me up a little and reminded me what I was driving.

 

test drove an AP2 ('05 NFR) today...loved the interior, but the handling and engine dynamics of the AP1 are more to my liking.

 

Lets not start another AP1 vs AP2 thing here.

Anyway, in 2004, Honda changed all the trannies in the world to use carbon synchros, which are much stronger than earlier models' synchros. The shifter also seems to pop into gear a bit cleaner (this is comparing used cars here). I'm saying year 2004 because some countries are still selling AP1s as of 2008.

From my understanding, this is how it is after 2004:

- Both AP1 and AP2 received revised synchros material
- AP2s got a lower secondary gear
- AP2s received taller gearing on 5th and 6th gear
- 1st to 4th gears' ratios remained the same on both AP1 and AP2
- the final drive ratio remained the same at 4.10

The gear ratios are as follows:

AP1 vs AP2
1st 3.133 vs 3.133
2nd 2.045 vs 2.045
3rd 1.481 vs 1.481
4th 1.161 vs 1.161
5th 0.971 vs 0.943
6th 0.811 vs 0.765
Reverse 2.80 vs 2.80
Final Drive 1.16 vs 1.206
Axle Ratio 4.10 vs 4.10


As far as misshift, it is truly easy to misshift from 3rd to 2nd on a left-hand drive car. I've never done it on my LHD S2000 (and my other car before), but I can tell you it doesn't look that hard since most people "pull" the shifter with the palm facing themselves. As for RHD cars, I think it'll be a bit more difficult. But it could still happen I think.

 

Here's the official specs from Honda News:


http://www.hondanews.com/categories/898/releases/1501


-----------------------------------

Transmission Ratios Reconfigured in 2004

Gears 1-4 = 4% lower for performance
Gear 5 = 1% lower
Gear 6 = 2% higher

 

Haha thanks

Was just digging up the actual numbers while you typed the link

Anyway, contrary to some beliefs, the gear ratios were actually the same from 1st to 4th. The "effective" ratios were changed because of the small change in final drive.

 

But the gearing is different. From Honda:

Transmission Ratios -
Gears 1-4 = 4% lower for performance
Gear 5 = 1% lower
Gear 6 = 2% higher

So the ratios are the same for some gears, but the final drive makes the difference?

Also, from Honda, for reference:

Six-Speed Manual Transmission

The S2000 uses a longitudinally mounted, 6-speed manual transmission, which is built for high performance. Its gearing ensures strong performance in every gear, and the shift linkage is very direct, with short, precise throws. For 2004, single carbon synchronizers on all forward gears replace double- and triple-cone brass synchronizers in order to provide a more direct shift feel and reduce mechanical loss in the transmission. Other features of the S2000 drivetrain include a compact pull-type clutch with a clutch delay system, a highly rigid, one-piece propeller shaft and rigid axle shafts-all designed to reduce drivetrain flex to an absolute minimum. The Torsen limited-slip differential is a highly efficient torque-sensing, clutchless type that smoothly transfers torque to the wheel with the most traction, whether cornering or accelerating in a straight line.

 

Overall gearing is different, yes, but the individual gears 1 through 4 are actually identical.

 

Exactly. One could lower the effective gear ratio by changing the ratios on the gears, final drive gear ratio, or axle gears.

The easiest one to change is axle gears. So swapping out the factory 4.10 to 4.56 would also lower the effective gearing by about 10%.

(actually I may be wrong on the terminology ... because I've heard people referring the final drive ratio as secondary ratio, and some referring the axle ratio as final ... )

 

Here's how Honda uses the terminology:

"Final Drive" is the ring and pinion in the diff. It's 4.10 and has not changed since the first S2000.

"Secondary Gear Reduction" is an extra gear set, always engaged, in the transmission. It was 1.160 for AP1, and is now 1.208 for AP2.

http://www.hondanews.com/categories/898/releases/4096