I have some questions concerning various driving habits and their effects on the drivetrain. I did some searches with limited success. If you have some knowledge to share or can direct me to the proper links, I would greatly appreciate it. Thanks in advance.

What are the negative effects (if any) can the following actions have on the S2000 drivetrain (besides normal wear and tear)? What alternative techniques should be employed? All situations are assuming straight line driving.

--Skipping upshifts (i.e. shifting from 4th to 6th gear) I have read a thread that had some information and pictures on this a while back, but I cannot find that thread anymore.

--Skipping downshifts (i.e. 6th to 4th)

--Cruising in gear, then coasting by shifting the stick to Neutral position to decelerate. Is there any difference between leaving the stick in Neutral and leaving stick in gear while depressing and holding the Clutch?

--Cruising in gear, then coasting in same gear while letting off of the throttle to decelerate.

--Shifting through more than one Gear while depressing and holding the Clutch. Does this have any effect at all (+/-)? (i.e. in 6th gear, depressing and holding Clutch, shifting 6-5-4-3, then releasing clutch and pressing throttle to downshift) Do the synchros do anything when the clutch is depressed?

That is all that I can think of for now. Thanks for the input.

 

Skipping shifts up or down is hazardous to your synchros:
https://www.s2ki.com/forums/index.ph...pic=19674&st=0

If you coast in gear, the ECU will shut off the fuel injectors, saving you gas. If you coast in neutral, some people might yell at you and say it's dangerous. If you coast with the clutch pedal depressed, you will get a sore leg.

The synchros are at work whenever you shift between gears, whatever you are doing with your clutch.

Maybe someone can chime-in about wear & tear to the throwout bearing if you ride your clutch pedal all the time.

 

I'm not claiming to be a drivetrain guru. Just to share my opinion. I agree pretty much with foolio.

One comment is that skipping gears on upshift isn't automatically harzardous to the synchros, although the chance is high. If you match revs for the skip-gear upshift (meaning to wait a bit long for the bigger rpm drop), then no harm should be done to the synchros. Same applies to any shifting. As long as you match revs, no harm.

Coasting at idle (whether clutch in or not in gear) is not automatically dangerous but I'm curious why would someone want to do that especially in a performance car? To save gas? To reduce noise? To avoid forgetting to depress the clutch at a complete stop for the stick-shift newbie? I always coast in-gear/clutch-out. In an emergency braking, that'll less likely lock up or induce ABS on the drive wheels. Also, the engine is more eager to rev when blipping the throttle for a downshift in an emergency situation requiring sudden acceleration.

Wearing out the throw-out bearing is not the main concern for people riding the clutch. Wearing out the thrust bearing on the crankshaft is.

 

Thanks for the help so far! I think I understand most of it.

As far as coasting in neutral, I meant like when coming to a complete stop. How do you decelerate properly to a complete stop at a traffic light, stop sign, etc? Should I stay in gear and brake until the RPMs drop to 2k then depress the clutch and shift the stick to neutral? Should I engage each consecutively lower gear, then get to neutral to stop?

Here is another situation I would like advice on. When coming to a 90 degree turn, while slowing down from cruising speed in 6th gear, if I want to get into 2nd gear before the turn do I have to heel-toe each gear? Or can I hold the clutch and shift the stick down each gear w/o letting go of the clutch? Do the syncros help me there?

Thanks again for the help!

 

One of the things that makes driving the car easier is learning to relax.

When you're coming to a stop, do whatever feels comfortable. When downshifting from say fifth to second, nudge the synchro's in fourth, and third, before easing the shifter into second. If you rev match you don't need to nudge the synchros in every gear when skipping gears. It's not really *that* critical.

The synchro's will work if you go directly from sixth to second, but they have to work hard; you make their life easier by rev matching or bumping the synchro's for each gear to allow each successive synchro to do a little of the work. As long as you're not forcing or beating the synchros you shouldn't have excessive wear.

For some reason some owners seem to have problems with second gear grinding, which usually indicates a bad synchro, but since I haven't had the problem (pushing 50,000 miles now) I tend to think that it must have at least as much to do with the driver as it does with the car.

My experience has been that the little cars are a heck of a lot tougher than the posts here on S2kI might make one think.

 

The driver determines the amount of damage done to the S. Become one with your transmission and enjoy the rewards.

1. What alternative techniques should be employed?

I suggest learning how to drive, match gears, double clutch, heal/toe, etc.


2. --Skipping upshifts (i.e. shifting from 4th to 6th gear) I have read a thread that had some information and pictures on this a while back, but I cannot find that thread anymore.

See #1; try waiting a bit before ramming gear into 6th


3. --Skipping downshifts (i.e. 6th to 4th)

See #1, try clutch in, shift into neutral, clutch out, rev match for 4th, clutch in, shift into 4th, clutch out. One you master that try it while simultaneously braking.

4. Is there any difference between leaving the stick in Neutral and leaving stick in gear while depressing and holding the Clutch?
Read this link


5. --Cruising in gear, then coasting in same gear while letting off of the throttle to decelerate.

Try this, don

 

Nothing you mentioned is going to hurt any component of the car if you are just smooth about it. I personally always put my cars into nuetral coming up to a stop, then put it back into 1st to accelerate from the stop once the light turns green. This puts less wear and tear on your motor [compared to engine braking], clutch, and thrust bearings. It's also usually much smoother and pleasurable for your passenger.
On my bikes, I do use engine braking because it is much more effective compared to use in cars, and you must engine brake to a certain extent because 6th => nuetral shifts are impossible, you must go through the gears. The key here is being smooth, if you go from 3rd to 6th, just do it slowly and gently so that all the gears have time to align properly. These cars are much tougher than it is seemingly displayed here.

 

[QUOTE=sahtt,Dec 13 2005, 12:20 PM]The key here is being smooth, if you go from 3rd to 6th, just do it slowly and gently so that all the gears have time to align properly.

 

Thank you everyone for all of the feedback. I think I am absorbing most of this information pretty well. Although I am not new to driving stick, I lack knowledge about the mechanical workings of a manual transmission (especially syncros) and am very curious about how they operate. I appreciate all of the flame-free informative posts so far.

Off Topic:
I noticed how many S2000 owners have owned/currently own Miata's as well. I guess that is not much of a coincidence due to the similarities between the two. It seems odd however how much Miata-bashing some S2K owners do. It doesn't make sense to me since the original Miata was the genesis of the modern day roadster. If anything S2K's should have some respect for the Miata like an elder.
Yes. If you haven't already guessed, I own a Miata (my 1st roadster).

BTW RedMX5, I am plenty relaxed while driving. I will admit though that the S generally gets me excited about everytime I drive it!

 

We have a first year Miata and a first year S2000, and owning the S2000 does NOT make the Miata one bit less fun than it was the day we brought it home. We bought the car in '91 when it was returned from a 12-month lease. Except for the alternator, the car has been and remains trouble free, and it sips gas as if the stuff cost two bucks a gallon.

The Miata was NOT my first roadster, but as you say, it was a landmark car.

The S2000 is every bit as tough as the Miata. Drive as hard as you like, but do it smoothly. As long as you don't beat the car up it will serve you well.