Ran into some issues with my 06 AP2 recently and am currently unable to start it. When I try to start it, I just get a very fast clicking noise. Problems started a couple months back with unrelated issues and it just seems to be spiraling down at this point - hoping someone can help! I did throw an error at one points -- something related to the PCM. I did not save it unfortunately.

Problem began as intermittent about a month ago, soon after I'd taken the car into a Midas to have the rear brake calipers replaced. Soon after the brake work I got a TCS/ABS warning -- topped off the fluid and that went away. During a cold start the car failed to start, seemed to lock the steering wheel, then started a few minutes later. For the next week or so it would randomly have issues starting, not turning over. I took in the battery (a ~6 mos old Optima yellow top) to have it tested, and it tested fine. Decided to replace the starter -- was also due for new spark plugs and a new serpentine belt so I went ahead and did those, and stripped and resprayed the valve cover while I was at it. The engine at least *looks* pretty decent.




Was excited to start it up and as I mentioned, now it just clicks, won't start for the life of it. I went and bought a new battery last night -- same issue. Starter solenoid makes a rapid clicking noise but doesn't seem to engage to try to turn the motor over. I turned it over by hand it and turns smooth as can be.

Any thoughts on what might be causing the issues? I'm not sure what to try next -- thoughts were re-pull the spark plug cover and re-torque them to 19lbs in case my approximate twist wasn't enough -- maybe unbolt the starter, remove it from its housing, then reinstall it? I did check the wire going from the battery to the fuse box; nothing looked out of ordinary in the fuse box but maybe there's something there I should be checking?

The only thing I can think of that could be causing the problem is the ECU itself -- the wonky behavior before the starting issues (ABS/TCS alerts, PCM error) make me think the ECU could possibly be the problem. I have little to no experience working with ECUs so that's kinda just a stab in the dark.

TLDR: clicking noise, doesn't turn over, battery good, new starter, new spark plugs

 

Rapid clicks usually mean not enough current to turn the starter over. You said you just changed your battery (did you charge it first?), so in my opinion you should check your grounds, battery terminals, and 12V wire at the starter. Make sure everything is nice and snug, and if you have a multimeter, check resistances. You could also try a jump start just in case.

 

Roger thanks, I'll re-check the main wire to the starter and make sure it's nice and snug; entirely possible I didn't tighten it down enough with the wiggled-in socket on a long extension and swivel. Will see if I can hit it without the swivel-head attachment & lookup the torque value. I did throw the battery on a tender until it was fully charged. Thanks for the reply!

 

Chattering starter motor is normally a dead battery and Optimas are poor lightweight batteries to start with. Jump start will probably work.

Spark plugs need 24lbf-ft not 19. Probably not a factor here but if you're going to torque them do it right. Notes from 6 years ago.

-- Chuck

 

I have the OEM service manual and it calls for 18 ft-lb. I see Billman recommends 24, but I just replaced mine and stuck with the factory’s number.

I understand some plugs have backed out at the original 13 ft lb number (from first year production), however Honda updated the number to 18 themselves to fix the issue.

 

You can absolutely trust Billman. I do and made a pen and ink correction in the Service Manual. Read the whole thread I linked. Several things have changed since our cars were produced and spark plug torque is one of them.

-- Chuck

 

The risk of a plug coming loose is a destroyed engine (loose plug causes misfire, misfire damages plug, plug tip falls off into cylinder, carnage results).

The risk of tightening plugs to 24 lb ft is... Nothing. They'll easily handle twice that.

This being the case, why would you not torque them to leading experts strong recommended value?

Regarding the valve cover, whi stripped the paint and how? If it was media blasted, DO NOT START THE CAR. Get a new valve cover, as yours is a ticking time bomb that will destroy your engine. Hopefully too much damage hasn't already been done. Its impossible to get all the old media out if these covers are blasted. Too many stories of lost engines from this.

It is possible to remove baffle, clean, and reinstall, but this has to be done perfectly, or else whatever is used to secure baffle can come loose and cause similar issue. Old baffle mounts have to be ground off.

As to your actual starting issue, not enough current is getting to starter. Either because not enough voltage is available to push current through the resistance, or because there is too much resistance (bad wiring, bad relay, etc.)

 

Thanks to all! Was able to get it started last night. I replaced the chassis to block ground but otherwise all I did was tighten things up a bit and give it a crank with the DieHard battery I'd picked up. I think honestly either the grounds or the battery leads weren't torqued down enough from the 10mm wrench I was using, and likely needed the extra torque I applied with a socket wrench. Sparks plugs are now torqued to their correct value. Had never really heard anything about poorly seated spark plugs causing detonation so I wasn't that worried about under-torquing them, but didn't want to over-torque and risk stripping the aluminum head. Good to hear there's a nice safety factor and I don't have to worry much about that.

Regarding the valve cover, I removed the remaining paint by hand -- combination of sandpaper & wire brushes. The car has about 143K miles on it so most of the exposed OEM paint had long since chipped off. No media blasting involved just some raw knuckles by the end. Thank you for the heads up on that though -- I can imagine that's destroyed a few engines. A few remnant particles of paint should be OK, but I'll plan to replace the oil soon to get out whatever paint particles may have found their way under the baffle.

Car came with the Carbon Fiber hood installed -- I'm guessing that the hood retains more heat and its proximity to the valve cover led to a little more heat on the valve cover itself -> paint chipping off more than you usually see. I picked up a replacement OEM hood that I'm hoping to strip and have painted LBP by this Spring.

 

Just a note for fun: Billman had an old head lying around and decided to test it. He kept increasing the torque until failure. I believe he was up around 60-70 or so when the spark plug failed. The threads never stripped.

 

In Bill's test the spark plug broke at 80 lbf-ft.

From the thread linked in post #4:-- Chuck