Save the Manual Wagons!

Here's the $4,446 question: which control arm bushings typically wear out, and are the Mugen/Hardrace rubber bushings a suitable OEM replacement? I'm going after factory ride quality, so I obviously don't want poly.

Long story: my S2000 is 22 years old and has 80,000 miles. When I bought it the rear shocks were leaking and completely blown, so I replaced all four with a "25k mile" OEM set. I also had my mechanic replace one balljoint that was creaking horribly. The ride is better now, but still pretty bad. The car is always moving around and never settled, especially on the highway. Moderate bridge expansion joints are enough to cancel the cruise control. Small to moderate bumps send the rear end bottoming out. I hear occasional creaking and groaning from the suspension, especially when pulling into a driveway.

I recently re-did the entire suspension on my Mazda2: shocks, struts, balljoints, control arms, inner and outer tie-rods, sway bar end-links + bushings. The difference was amazing. It feels like a new car now (10 years old, 100k). I priced out most of that stuff for the S2000 and it came to $4,446!! See list below.

Honda won't sell the control arm bushings separately, you have to buy the whole arm. Mugen and Hardrace both sell firmer (?) rubber bushings and a set goes for about $750-850 compared to $2100 for the new Honda arms. But they don't sell bushings for the rear upper control arms.

OEM parts from one of the Honda sites:
- Front shocks $496
- Front lower ball joints $172
- Front sway bar end links $60
- Front lower control arms $726
- Front upper control arms $456
- Front inner tie rods $154
- Front outer tie rods $102

- Rear shocks $694
- Rear sway bar end links $126
- Rear toe control arms $166
- Rear lower control arms $766
- Rear upper control arms $528

Fine print: car is completely stock except for 17" rims and new Continental ECS tires, AP2 sizing, inflated to 32 psi.

B serious

You should not need to do any of this at 80K miles. Its massively unsual.

Has the car been totally hammered thru its life? Or do you live in a desert?

How is the alignment, and what tires are on the car?

Mugen or Hardrace are both excellent replacement choices if you do want bushings. Remember to clock them during the installation....or you'll need new bushings again in a few months.

baldspot_lol

first thing i would do is replace sway bar / ARB drop links. i have had a couple cars that sounded like they were at deaths door, banging, scraping, groaning that felt like new with 4 new drop links. its the cheapest option too. (other than checking nothing is pysically broken, i.e. coil springs)

Save the Manual Wagons!

The car was from Los Angeles and was badly neglected. When I got it the alignment was terrible, steering wheel didn't point straight, rear shocks were leaking and completely blown, one balljoint was creaking horribly, other unrelated stuff... It also had old, rock hard tires. Going over bumps produced the most violent rear-end bottoming out I've ever experienced in a car.

The used shocks, new tires, new balljoint and alignment is an improvement, but still not good enough. I didn't get alignment numbers but the car drives straight now.

Tires are new Continental ECS, AP2 size, inflated to 32psi.

I'm guessing it's mostly the shocks, but replacing that other stuff on my Mazda2 really made a difference (strut front/torsion beam rear, so not exactly a fair comparison, but still...) On my S2000, I can turn the tie-rod ends and sway bar end-links by hand. There's no slop yet, but doesn't that mean they're getting old?

I haven't visually inspected the lower front compliance bushings yet, which sound like the ones that go first.

baldspot_lol

eh, its hard to tell when theyre still on the car. what i can say is your symptom of banging and graoning when turning into a driveway (up a slight ramp/ grade / bump? mine is) is exactly what my sway bar links sounded like. you're loading one corner severely which the sway bar is trying to fight, loading the bar (therefore links) heavily.
going over a rough driveway / potholes was like banging a hammer repeatedly on plastic / metal.

B serious

Its normal to be able to swivel the joints on the sway bar links and tie rods by hand. They're very stiff when brand new, but the motion will loosen up quickly with age. Doesn't mean they're bad...as long as there is no freeplay in them.

A refresh always feels good, so go for it. For the compliance bushings, I would highly recommend sphericals.

I'd do the whole damn car in spherical to be honest. But the compliance bushings at the very least. Use Hardrace or Megan parts.

Hardrace also sells replacement ball joints, front tie rods, and rear toe rods.

One last thing to try....

are you sure the top or other parts are not rattling and giving you the perception of harshness? A car that has a lot of rattles from loose parts or just junk flying around in the car will seem very harsh because of all the noise and vibration felt from those rattles.

The wandering on the highway and cruise cancelling over expansion joints points to rotted out bushings or blown shocks or a terrible alignment. I guess just inspect stuff before you dive in.

Save the Manual Wagons!

Do the spherical bushings have the same quality/longevity as OEM? And, critically, will they provide the same NVH and ride quality?

This is strictly a street car for me. And I live in Wisconsin, where the roads are not great.

It's not perception. I've been through this with cars before and keep the trunk/interior as empty as possible, check the obvious stuff, etc. I still need to fix the rattling top latches but it's a pretty 'solid' car. The passenger seat-back sometimes makes noise.

B serious

I have one S2000 with spherical compliance bushings only. It is 200% street car. There's virtually no added NVH. Hardrace sphericals are booted like OEM sphericals are. No maintenance....and should last as long as ...say...a ball joint would. I think I have ~20K on this. I live in the Chicago burbs...so...roads like yours.

I have another one with all sphericals. Next to virtually no difference in NVH there either. It drives like a dream. Everything is super instant, and the movements are ultra smooth/precise. This one is a track car more than it is a street car. But boy, does she glide.

I don't foresee any maintenance or replacements for a very long time. Megan/HR are extremely high quality parts.

Both are on coilovers. Ohlins (10K/10K) on the first one. FA500 14K/12K on the 2nd one.

You notice the sphericals on something like rumble strips. But even then...its only mildly more "pingy" than stock.

I think sphericals get a bad reputation because maybe people are comparing them to old school joints with metal/metal bearings and low precision. They were clunky and rattly because of the freeplay. They were also not reliable and didn't seal anything out.

You'd be surprised how many cars come from the factory with sphericals nowadays. Subaru STi's, BMW's, Porsches, Acura TL's, etc.

meat_sweats

These cars are not known for ride comfort, temper your expectations. My Uncle had a brand new one back in 03 or 04 that I drove and it took bumps like a skateboard.

B serious

Idk if its supposed to be as bad as the OP is describing though, right?

But the stock suspension is overly harsh, yes. Its meant to make the car feel engaging and hyperactive.