Well, my suspicions were confirmed. I put the stock camshafts back in the car and headed back to the dyno. The stock cams made the same amount of power on the top end, and even better power on the low end, when compared w/ the Toda cams.
Here's the chart... see for yourself (red is Toda, blue is OEM). Ignore the gap from 5700-6000 RPMs... I had the VTEC crossover set differently between the two runs... however fuel tuning was identical (as you can see from the A/F charts).

Toda cams (red) vs OEM (blue) torque graph



WTF...

 

Did it really feel 80 deg. F at Speedworks? It seemed cooler than that here in McKinney.

 

Have you compared the Toda cams to your OEM cams (ie. measured the lobes with a caliper) to see if they are even different.

 

80 degrees? Probably not outside, but the shop was pretty warm. I couldn't say for sure... but it was about the same as last weekend, so these two graphs should be a fair comparison.

As for the measurements... no, I haven't measured either set of cams. I don't have the equipment for that. However, the Toda cams are out now, so if anybody has the equipment, it might be a worthy venture.

I hate to point this out, but these results are somewhat similar to the ones that I got when my valves were mis-adjusted (i.e., no gains on top-end, and losses on the low-end)... though the losses on the low end aren't quite as dramatic as before. However, I don't think that's the problem, because 1) I triple-checked valve clearances every time I installed the cams, and 2) even after re-installing the stock cams all of the valves were still within spec... without even needing adjustment.

BTW... TypeSH was out there in his Prelude and put down good numbers, so I think that kinda rules out dyno-accuracy problems. Now, it's all about the cams.

 

I'd have to concur that these cams are a big waste of money. I lost an engine due to them. The mechanic would always like to put blame on the component though... which is why I would never go to nor recommend his shop to anyone. I also gained no power, so IMO it's not worth anyone's time and money unless you have alot of both to throw away... When you have them in your car you always want to rationalize them producing more power, but even in a recent incident with my car, sometimes it's too good to be true...

 

these cams suck ass

 

How did you lose an engine to these cams? I must've missed that story. What happened exactly, and how were the cams to blame. What "component" was the mechanic blaming?

What incident? Care to expand?

 

Funny... I didn't hear you saying that when you were trying to sale a set of these cams.
No offense, but have you said anything useful in this thread?

You claim that you lost power with the Toda cams, but you won't back it up with dyno charts (because you used them to wipe your ass.. that's a mature excuse).

You claim that you first lost power when you installed the Toda cams, and then you claim that the second time that you installed them you broke even... but you don't tell us what you changed or did differently.

At one point in the thread, you claim that Toda provided "different installation instructions", yet you never back that up by actually providing the information that Toda gave to you. Why won't you share? Were you just making that up?

Sounds like a load of to me.

 

I would like to thank for having the headache for me, I was about to buy the following items from Hong Kong (prices in HK$)

AP1 TODA IN CAM 295 SPEC A2 $3600 (IN STOCK)
AP1 TODA EX CAM 290 SPEC A2 $3600 (IN STOCK)
AP1 TODA STRONG VALVE SPRING SET $2900 (IN STOCK)
AP1 SPOON VALVE SET (F20C) $3300 (IN STOCK)
AP1 (F20C) SPOON 2P 0.46 HEAD GASKET　$1500 (IN STOCK)

and since the only thing that the TODA cams are good for is sucking money out of our pockets, I will not buy the above.
Another thing is that TODA USA really sucks, after taking your time and sending 'em a e-mail, this is the reply you receive:

"The information on our web site is of the Spec A2 camshafts. http://www.todaracing.com/products/honda_s.../camshafts.html
Best regards,
TODA Racing USA/AKH Trading"

Realy great

 

I'm no longer an S2000 owner, so don't have the interest in this I once had. But here's an interesting fact from the UK. One of the failed A2 cams from the UK was sent to one of the UK's cam manufacturers too see what they made of the failure - as they're possible going to be making cams for the F20C at some time in the future. They found one interesting thing that had been missed. The failed cam was about 5 thousandths of an inch out of true. When that happened isn't clear - it could potentially have happened during handling after removal, during installation, during the failure, or been like that from new. It would be interesting to see if the same problem is there on any of the other failed cams.

-Brian.