Oil Burn
 

I've done nearly 700 miles in the new Stook and noticed the oil level near the bottom of the indicator. I know they are supposed to burn some oil in the early days but 1.5 litres in 700ish miles - is this normal? Can anyone recommend a good top up oil? The Honda garage wanted to put in some stock rubbish that they use in Civics and other sensible cars. Comments please ladies and gentlemen.

:cool:

This is not unduly heavy. You must check your oil regularly. Mine used oil heavily up till about the first service. It hardly uses any at all now. Remember as well that VTEC is totally dependant for it's performance on your oil level being up to the mark. The mechanism that brings in your VTEC cam lobes is oil operated. It is also generally accepted that Honda put a special 'break in' oil in the new S2000's. You are not advised to change to fully synthetic oil till after your first service. I changed at 6000 miles to Mobil 1 and have used it since. You will find opinions divided on this board about what is the best oil to use eventually, .but at the stage you are now, your engine will use oil whatever you put in it! I would take the view that your Honda dealer should know what to advise for now (mirthful laughter from the gallery)At least if you follow their advice at this stage, it's ammo if anything goes wrong under warranty. At the risk of labouring the point, at the stage you are now you can't check the oil often enough. 700 miles is far too long:eek: Have a look in FAQ's and do a search on oil. You'll find loads of threads on the subject.

I remember checking mine at 1500 and finding exactly the same, 1.5L for 700 does seem a little bit high but this engine will burn a lot of oil during run-in particuarly if you live in the VTEC zone.

I've gone through about 4.5L in 6000 miles. I'm using GTX Magnatec but only because Its not synthetic but a good grade oil. When I've had the 7500 mile service I'll probably switch to Mobil 1 synthetic. Any good quality oil should be ok. If you use the search facility on the site you'll find stacks of posts on oil consumption.

mmmm.. reminds me, I should check my oil levels....
:rolleyes:

Don't forget the more topped up you are the better it VTECs!!:D

Mine used the same amount of oil from new. Should settle down at about 7k miles. As the man said, if its burning oil, then its getting in the right places!

[QUOTE]Originally posted by S2KXKEman
[B]Mine used the same amount of oil from new.

I'm at 4000 miles now and it seems to have bedded in nicely.
I have been topping up with Mobil1 as advised by my dealer.

:cool:

I've been some research into this. The reason for S2k's burning more oil than normal Vtec's during run in is due to the construction of the block. It's fibre reinforced aluminium, which is very strong and light, but it's requiring longer for the pistol rings to get a perfect seal.

The concensus is that the break in oil is very high in molybdenum - the idea being that this fills in the very tiny scratches in the bore to provide a good seal for the piston rings. So the high oil consumption is oil getting past the piston ring and bruning off - but this is what you want, as over time the seal will settle.

Keep your oil topped up and comsuption should drop off to pretty much zero by your first service, if not long before. Do take care not to over fill though - Vtec runs off oil pressure, but overfilling can be very dangerous for the engine.

As to the exact oil to put in.... nobody seems to have a definitive answer. Certainly it's a bad idea to change to fully synthetic oil until the engine has bedded in (at least 7,000 miles seems to be the concensus), but for top up? I don't think it's going to matter as the percentage of new oil should still be pretty low.

-Brian.

Cedric

I run an E Type 4.2 FHC which does about 500 miles per pint of oil after 200,000 miles - should be run in by now. It also leaks about a pint every 500 miles, so topping up has become habitual.

I change the Honda oil and filter every 4,500 miles as the engine is very high revving unlike the jaguar which rarely sees 5k revs.

[QUOTE]Originally posted by S2KXKEman
[B]Cedric

I run an E Type 4.2 FHC which does about 500 miles per pint of oil after 200,000 miles - should be run in by now.

Chalk and cheese. The E Type is full of grunt, you can pull away in 4th gear all the way up to 150mph. Whereas the Honda's power comes from the camshaft and you need the revs.

The E Type is exciting around corners and does not brake too well. Also it has a rudimentary heating system and no air con.

Mind you, when you consider that it was developed from the D Type during the late 50's, it was a very advanced car:

Disc brakes all round
Monococue body (no Chassis)
Heater
Heated rear screen
3 electric windscreen wipers
Independent rear suspension
Limited slip diff
Twin cam motor with aluminium head
Electric cooling fan

You cannot really compare them due to the age difference. However, there is only 10 kilograms between them and their performance is very similar. One does it with 2 litres and the other with a little over double that.

That equates to a lot of technical development over 40 years (This year is the 40th anniversary of the E Type)

Thanks for the advice - I will keep my eye on the oil level and monitor the total consumption. It's good to know that I'm not the only one whose experienced this. I take the point about keeping the oil right up at the top to get decent VTEC performance - I hope there is a reasonable threshold between "fill" and "overfill" otherwise it won't be just the tyres smoking!!!

stooksteer
U have got a faulty Block.

The dealer should have monitored your oil over the next 500 - 1000 miles.

U should request a new engine now. There is a long waiting list.

When my engine was pulled apart the engineer noticed that the 4 piston was black in comparison with the other pistons.

I am very surprised that a car that has the tendancy to burn oil has not got a oil warning light!

RP

RICARDO....

To save me doing something unpleasant in my trousers please expand on your last post! The concensus seems to be that some oil consumption in the early days is to be expected. If there is an engine problem are there any other tell-tale problems? The car seems to be running fine without any other obvious signs of potential catastrophe .....
:eek:

Stookster:

Whoa!!! Some cars do have a problem with failure of No 4 cylinder. Honda are aware and are rectifying where necessary. To jump to this conclusion is plain silly at the moment. Keep an eye on your oil!!! If you are unduly worried ask your Honda dealer to check it out. At the moment it all sounds very normal:)
I believe ricardo has had big probs. but it's early days to state just because you are using oil, that yours are as serious.

Stooksteer
Get your dealer to monitor your oil usage.

The car will still work perfectly OK once the oil level is fine. Your tail pipes might get a bit smokey.

I have used mine for months. Sweet as a nut.

RL

WTF!!!!

mmmm.... I think I am about to get anal about oil consumption!!!

One other point - is everyone topping up with mineral oil rather than part synthetic during break-in ?

Stookster:
Check your oil very regularly.. you will need to top up a lot. It's normal. You shouldn't use synthetic till after your first service, say 7000kish. On the question of whether to use mineral or part synthetic till then, my guess is mineral, but check with your dealer.
I can understand your concern after ricardo's last two contradictory posts, which haven't helped.

https://www.s2ki.com/forums/showthread.php?...&threadid=25361

The above thread contains a lot of good info about the #4 failure and how it may be related to low oil whilst cornering.

Cedric
Thanks for the links relating No 4.

RP

What it comes down to I think, is that the F20C is a cutting edge high performance engine which is very revolutionary in its design.
Apart from the fact that VTEC depends on oil pressure, it seems that due to something inherent in the design, there is a tendency for #4 cylinder to become starved of oil under the influence of hard right hand cornering IF THE OIL LEVEL IS LOW!! You really do need to be anal about checking the oil level regularly. There is every possibiity that if Honda feel the problem is due to the user not topping up, they will not feel they have any warranty obligation:(
This doesn't alter the fact there there is a known problem in that SOME engines develop the problem due to faulty machining. Honda are putting these problems right under warranty where they become apparant with no quibbles, so the answer is not to weaken your warranty rights by what they are likely to call 'User neglect' if you don't top up your oil ;)
All this must be alarming for new owners when they see the amounts of oil the car consumes initially. In my own case I was very worried by the amount of oil I was regularly putting in to start with, but this gradually tailed off to the point that I rarely have to add oil at all these days. This doesn't prevent me from checking the oil at least weekly and in the middle of any long drive. There's a member called Barry/Silver/Black something like that, on the U.S. Board who has spent a great deal of time documenting, collating and researching this #4 problem. If you do a search you'll find a number of his threads.

In case anyone is wondering... if you had to buy a replacement engine, you would be out of pocket to the tune of

Cedric
I don't want to get into an argument about this issue, but I think your conversation is very wrong.

If the oil levels was to be checked on every performance car on a weekly basis, we would not have F1, indy car and touring car championships.

The engineer who fitted the alarm to my car told why engines burn large quantities of oil before I was told that their was a fault with no4. He also said that the 300ZX and 740 BMW(V8) enines had piston failure a couple of years ago. Both companies did a full recall and changed the complete engine if your car was under warrenty or if U had a full service history.

If honda was to published this sort of information, surely they would be digging a grave for the s2000.

Honda are forced to fixed the engines under warrenty. They have no choice. This is the general feedback I get from honda UK.

I think we should discuss why an oil warning light is not fitted to the car?

RL

Hey, who's arguing:cool: I'm just trying to help new owners to see the picture:)

Before you base your grievances with Honda around not having an oil warning light you really ought to check your handbook:(

Cedric
There is warning light available for low oil pressure.

Personally I think that it is a Hazard to have such a warning light.

If U are waiting for this light to give U any indication then its going to be too late.

The light does flash ocasionally (low oil, changing down and stoping). But this won't attrack your normal day to day driver.

Actually I will pass this to honda technical. I think this is a very valid question.

RL

To be fair, yes,..there is some suggestion that the light doesn't come on till the oil is very low. If you can get Honda to raise the level at which it activates, it can only be a good thing. Good luck to you.:)

The oil light really surprises me. I'm sure it can't be too difficult to have an oil level guage on the dash.... After all my old Laguna has one...... :eek:

I'm at 12000, and still using a (US) Quart every 2000. My dealer cautioned specifically against using a synthetic until this changes.

Just topped up my oil... stuck 1litre of GTX Magnatec in.... seems fine. A little smoother somehow ?
Now done around 7,800 miles in 7 months.
I should think about that service soon :rolleyes:

Years ago had a Golf GTI 16v (ok, hohohoho!) - which consumed oil like fury up to about 8-10000 then never used a drop between services up to 95000 - when it was running very sweetly...all original parts!
Wife's Megane has one of these 5 x 'O's oil level gauges - but as a 40-50000 miles a year old fart I am manic about oil,coolant,washer levels & tyre pressures - comes from owning some bum cars in the past!