Luscombe

End005
How were you able to quantify the quality of the car before you purchased it from 1,200 miles away.

End005

The short answer - I didn't. It was a CR. I was looking to sell my AP1 for an AP2. I knew this one was available - and it was a CR. Learned it had low mileage. And it as a CR. So, I jumped on it.

The long answer: I didn't. At least not until after I had a long conversation with the seller and finalized my decision when I saw the car in person. I had already established a relationship with the seller as I had purchased some parts off him. A week later, I started to consider the idea of buying this specific car as I was looking to sell my AP1 for an AP2 for autocross. I decided to have serious conversations with the owner. He provided a long winded history of the car. I came to the conclusion that no expense was spared for the car. The mileage was low. The parts used on he car was quality high-end parts. All OEM parts were present and included. Any request of any odd photo, the owner provided along with videos. The seller gave me a great deal VS what most CRs were selling for. I proposed a counter offer, he accepted, and I booked my flight immediately.

When I finally arrive and saw the car in person - it was exactly as described by the seller. I brought and used my paint depth gauge (I detail on the side) and confirmed no body panels were repainted. Again, exactly as I wanted.

So, in conclusion - I didn't quantify the quality of this vehicle at all before I purchased the car. The character of the seller, the parts used, and seeing the car in person sealed it for me.

Luscombe

Relationship buying and selling, the heart of all successful businesses and transactions.

Excellent process and outstanding character. It's Herat when you can do business with some one you trust.
Thanks for their follow up End005

Gary

Chuck S

I went to college in Appleton, does this count? I admit I didn't remember Madison and Ma-waukee were so close to each other. Drove my S2000 from Cleveland to Appleton for a reunion last summer and back a couple of days later. No issues for me or the car. Cruise control helps on a long drive. The S2000 shares Honda reliability. I did this same drive in my (former) MGB decades ago and felt like I'd been in a fight when I got home.

What version to get is an easily solved question. Honda made modifications to these cars every two years. Mainly in the suspension area to keep us novice drivers on the road. There are those who enjoy sliding corners, I'm not one of them on public roads. Wrecks are reported weekly and often involve coming out of traffic circles (roundabouts) and freeway on ramps at too much speed in marginal weather or road conditions. Read the Wiki on this car for a good summary of the changes thru the years. First year cars had a folding plastic rear window for example and early cars were notorious for spinning inattentive drivers "into the cattails" as my buddy puts it and where put his 2002. Just got muddy.

The final "generation" S2000 started in 2006 (although there were later tweaks) with Drive-by-Wire. DBW allows the engine to be tuned without fitting an aftermarket ECU. The available increase in mid-range torque and power is amazing. The cable throttle guys think DBW is the anti-Christ but some don't realize all their other cars have been DBW for years.

Make a priority list. This will select your car by process of elimination. My list was headed by "2006 or later" as I wanted the more powerful available tune without recourse to supercharging. That alone limited me to 20% of the cars imported to the US. Then I wanted a car in the best condition possible to include all 10 body VIN tags, under 50,000 miles, good roof, clean/detailed condition, OEM configuration, etc. Found the car I wanted at a large Honda dealer. Serviced, detailed, etc. Missed the all-OEM mark as it had aftermarket wheels which I replaced the first month. Color was not on my priority list and I ended up with Silverstone -- actually a "rare" color in 2006. If you want/need a color it will further restrict your choice and some colors are not available after 2005. I found several very nice 2004 and 2005 cars. Close but no cigar.

-- Chuck

Luscombe

Chuck,

Thanks for the feedback. I have been reading and reading to get a better idea of specs and choices. Have not driven one yet though. Appreciate your reference to DBW as I did not know what that involved. I was leaning towards a 04-05 but with DBW, that will move to 06 or later. I am not looking for a hot rod, got that out of my system years ago. Love the reliability of the Honda's, just part of the allure to the S2000.
Some of my preferences include but not in order.

• Stock OEM vehicle or as close as possible
• Mileage 60k or below, depends upon condition, records, etc.
• OEM Hardtop
• Preferred colors in order Silver, White, Yellow, Blue, Red--May be subject to change based upon availability.
• VIn tags to match
• No crashes
• Complete maintenance records.
• OCD owner(s)
• As good a condition as possible
• 06 and above now on priority list. (More reading to do now)

Interestingly enough, I see lots of 05's for sale.

The hardtop is a must have for me. I am not sure of availability of OEM tops. Can you acquire at a dealer or strictly private owner or aftermarket.

Not in a hurry to acquire and will travel/fly to get right one. I am giving myself a year or so to locate one. Long distance purchase and PPI are of concern to me and am interested in how others have handled that. End005 handled it perfectly.

Thanks again Chuck.

Gary

TsukubaCody

If tunability is not a big deal for you, 04-05 would be perfect for your needs.

Luscombe

Sorry for my ignorance here. I don't have much experience with the S2000's and am not race enthusiest.

Not sure I completely understand "Tunability" as you use it. Are you saying that the 04-05 and are more difficult to tune or have less potential to tune?

I thought that the general S2000 engine set up allowed for much tunability, horse power and torque gain through after market components and systems. AP1 smaller displacement, higher revs, AP2 larger displacement, same HP and torque, developed at lower rpm. Aftermarket hop up kits available for both.

If I understand some of the DBW change, seems like parts of the system went to electronic control including traction control. My take away from that is the 06 and above have a "rear end" that does not have the proclivity to try and catch up with the "front end" as much as previous models without the stability control, a little more driver friendly to those who do not want to push the envelope.

So, for an OEM set up, is the ride more harsh in 04-05 AP2 than the 06 and above AP2? I understand that all that changes with after market springs, etc.

I promise I will continue my reading now!
Just wish there was an active club member or two in the area to chat with one on one.

Thanks,
Gary

Chuck S

Aftermarket intake and exhaust will do little for the car without a tune and may decrease performance. Car will sound better but the OEM ECU can only do so much. The pre-2006 cars are not tuneable in stock form and require an aftermarket ECU to do any changes. The DBW cars do have traction and stability assist (Honda stopped short of calling it stability control) and can be tuned via Hondata FlashPro. See the Gernby FlashPro tunes for rave reviews of what this can do for the car with a VTEC at 3600 rpm, not 6000. High power cam is just under my right foot at cruising speed/rpm.

OEM hard tops seem to be running in the $4,000 window. Typically available separately as guys wreck their cars or realize these are roadsters, not coupes. If I wanted a coupe I'd get a BRZ and add some power. In my (admittedly humble) opinion the S2000 is neither a daily driver nor a cold weather car. Max performance (or better) summer tires maximize the car's handling but don't work in cold weather which is the only time a hard top has any utility for me. I had one years ago on my MGB when I had to drive it all winter.

"Complete maintenance records." Few of us have enough OCD genes to bother saving the paperwork. Best you can expect is a clean CARFAX. But you might get lucky. The really only critical maintenance items are hypoid gear oil in the differential. NOT Honda differential oil. And the correct Honda S2000 oil filter. As far as the engine is concerned it likes 10W-30 to 5W-40 and doesn't care what bottle it comes from. Full synthetic for me (in all my cars). We all have our favorite brands of motor oil. For some it's whatever is on sale at Walmart and their cars are running fine.

If you can get the car on a lift the underbody will tell you how much winter the car has survived. Salted roads do wonders for cars.

Enjoy the search.

-- Chuck

TsukubaCody

Yep, the ECU bit is what I meant by tunability. If you're just looking to enjoy a stock car, an 04-05 would probably be the best value.

Luscombe

Well, I was able to get a few minutes of wheel time today on an 05 S2000 with 16K miles single owner. Didn't go far or fast but I did like the handling. Easy to drive and something my wife would like to drive.

I recommend the car, it is posted here in the for sale section in Madison. Very clean and well kept. The red color was a deal breaker for me. Mike, the owner was gracious enough to spend 40 minutes or so with me telling me about his experiences with the vehicle, none bad. He had some minor functionality complaints only. He is probably the same kind of driver that I am.

Thanks guys for the advice. I will continue to explore.
May have to take a run up to Elkhart Lake some Saturday and see if there are any S2000 running on the track.