s2000Junky

Running a square set up isnt the important aspect in this, you could be running a 255 square and another guy running a 255F 265R and he will out brake you all else equal. But yes a wider front tire will offer more braking grip (depending on the amount of camber your running) that’s the other key element in your tires footprint.

SlowTeg

While true, the advantage of non-staggered (specifically 255's all around) is cost (staggered 18" set of wheels and tires is $$$). Also, with a 255 tire up front it helps a lot with braking, running a much larger rear tire with an N/A car I'm not sure is very beneficial (especially if you move to r-comps). I haven't seen anyone do this test, but it'd be interesting. Boosted cars it makes sense to have more rear rubber, but even then a big concern is cost.

s2000Junky

Those are valid considerations, however ive managed to dodge them myself running 18" widths in custom 17" cost/weight sizes (for now). I haven’t run my 255/295 stagger with R comps in N/A form on the track, but have on extreme summers, and I experienced nothing but benefits from running that amount of rubber compared to more conventional widths. I would never want to run less tire in the back, as it adds so much more confidence in planting the car. The more common wavelength amongst us seems to be that you don’t need that much rubber in the back and or the motor wont be able to turn it effectively, but I never found that to be the case. If you consider the s2k is already a momentum type car out of the box, it takes corners fast, and with more rubber on the ground it allows you to maintain a higher speed overall through out the turn, so acceleration coming out of a turn is less a factor/less needed. A boosted S is the ult obviously, because it then does everything the best lol But then that requires a higher driving level to make use of. I never found any lack of benefits when going back to NA on my set up, let alone a hindrance. Running R comps should have some different considerations, since more G are at work on the car, but not in the stagger you choose per say, total available grip and balanced grip are two different things.

SlowTeg

Yep, your setup is definitely slick, but I'm still hesitant of custom widened wheels on the track (call me paranoid). Also the lack of tire selection >255mm on 17's sucks.. Another concern I forgot to mention is the concern of different tire diameters. I have an '06 w/ VSA and it isn't clear how VSA will handle different diameters. I don't mind it kicking on slightly more on the street (although it could be annoying), but don't want it acting up just putzing around.

I definitely like the feel/balance of the car with 225/255 staggered, but I'm going to try a sq setup for next yr w/ a bbk, and will try 255 square. We'll see how it goes. If I ever add boost down the road I'll definitely think about 18's and a staggered setup, but no plans for that anytime soon.. Cost wise the sq setup is hard to beat w/ 17's, we'll see how it compares, only one way to find out..

s2k4life_az

I looked at this as well when selecting my track wheels and tres in conjunction with my OEM wheels and tire combo. I wanted to keep the stagger given its a street and track build but wanted a bit more tire grip upfront for those track days. I have the following setup that is a good combo for my goals which may work for you.

Track application - AD08 tires 235/40-17 front, 255/40-17 rear on Advan RGD +54 n +60 offsets
Street application - RE11A tires 225/45-17 front, 255/40-17 rear on stock CR wheels and offsets

I did do some negative camber at -1.9 front and -2.8 rear while on Swift R springs and OEM CR shocks. I like the setup for now until my ability to driver at its limits improves.

s2k4life_az

Pic of stock wheels/tires. [attachment=66926::]

SlowTeg

The big problem I've seen with going with larger front tires is you ultimately run into the problem of the OEM front brakes no longer being upto the task. I'm just running 225 Z2's up front, and went through about 50% of some DTC60's in one weekend, with ducting. With 255's, they might be finished in a weekend. Sure, many folks that do TT's and others still run the stock front brakes, but they change them frequently, go through a set of front pads in a weekend, and risk cooking the front calipers. So, this leads to the issue of a BBK being a necessity imo if you visit the track frequently, which means OEM wheels are no longer an option (or you can run a 15-20mm spacer).

A local CR member running a square setup "welded" the piston of his caliper to the brake pad at a track day last year, and had to swap the caliper at the track. Not worth the headache/worry so best to just invest in a BBK from what I've seen.

s2k4life_az

I've never had a problem with braking on larger tires. For track days I have an extra set of OEM rotors with Carbotech C10/X8 setup. They work brilliantly. I also have SS brake lines and ATE fluid which help with modulating brake pressure. Honestly going to a larger tire actually helps with braking since there is more tire tread on the ground to use during hard breaking. There a lot of factors that amount to brake failure on track days (brake pads, brake fluid, cooling ability, driver application, weather, etc). I've even used OEM pads at AutoX and road track events and they work fine with larger tires. It all depends on how hard and frequent you brake at track events and your ability to cool them off. Now I use the Carbotech pads since I can drive faster into the turns so I can brake harder therefore needing more initial bite during weight transfer situations. I agree that multiple use of OEM pads on track events is not recommended or helpful when braking is key. Many S owners that are NA would advise staying with a good set of brake pads and high boiling point fluid for track use. Unless you go forced induction, there no need to a big brake kit in my opinion especially given the weight and balance of a NA car. A good tip when changing brake pads is to reapply big temp lube/grease to the caliper piston pins before your re-torque them. If you do this, you're less likely to get the caliper problem you described assuming that you aren't using your hand brake when parked at the track.

SlowTeg

I believe you're on the west coast, and people have said west coast tracks tend to be easier on brakes..? Regardless, the s2k oem brakes have been proven to be deficient, especially with a square setup. There are only a few reasons why a BBK wouldn't be needed on a track car from what I've seen. Ranked in order of importance:

#1- You're slow, and hence don't get upto faster speeds and use the brakes much. #2- The track doesn't have that much braking. #3- You're running crappy tires/not that much front grip.

A lot of local guys run Carbotech xp10s up front (the CR owner I mentioned was running XP10's). I can guarantee you some measely grease wouldn't have made a difference. It's physics, and the front brakes are on the small side up front. Big tires = more grip = more heat. Some tracks stress the brakes a lot more than others. The DTC60's are comparable to XP10's. Keep in mind, I'm not saying the stock brakes don't/can't work, just that they are overtaxed. Going through a set of brake pads in one weekend means you likely need a BBK. If you search through the R&C forum you'll see that people have problems with the stock brakes and many end up with a BBK.

s2k4life_az

Maybe the number of track runs on one set of pads, weather conditions, brake fluid, and driver use are key points in wear and fade. I am on the West and it may well be that our tracks are much easier to run given that most track don't have long straightaways where we can generate tons of speed. Most Arizona tracks are flat. California tracks are more fun with fun elevation changes. I've seen videos of tracks back east where you achieve higher speeds so I can understand the need for higher end brake components. Note I'm not a proponent of stock brake pads for track use. Carbotechs and better fluid have served me well for the few times a year I get out on the track. I can appreciate your points of view.