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Hungarian GP Qualifying (Spoiler)

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Old Aug 4, 2007 | 05:19 PM
  #31  
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Originally Posted by matrix,Aug 4 2007, 02:56 PM
And this just in....

Alonso loses five places, McLaren any points
05 August 2007 / Results / Photos

Fernando Alonso has been penalised by the FIA for holding up team-mate Lewis Hamilton in the pits during qualifying and will have to start from sixth in tomorrow's race. Moreover the sport's governing body felt that the team played a substantial part too in sabotaging its own driver's last run and will not be allowed to take any points away from the Hungarian Grand Prix.

The FIA ruled that the Spaniard and McLaren's constructors' points potential deserved to be punished for the pit-stop fracas after listening to the radio transmissions and video evidence from McLaren during the incident.

The FIA spent a good few hours evaluating all the evidence and now Lewis Hamilton will be promoted to pole position, for which the 22-year-old was unable to challenge when the hold up prevented him from doing a last final lap. Alonso will now have to start on the third row of the grid alongside Robert Kubica, who starts from seventh. Ralf Schumacher moves up to fifth, Nico Rosberg to fourth, Kimi Raikkonen to third and Nick Heidfeld to second.

McLaren has decided to appeal the decision about being docked points but is unable to do the same for Alonso's grid penalty. The hearing will happen sometime after the race.
LOL!! Looks like Alonso will get zero points out of this race. Hopefully LH wins and puts a chokehold on the championship.
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Old Aug 4, 2007 | 05:21 PM
  #32  
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Way to build a team, Fernando! What an a$$hole.
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Old Aug 4, 2007 | 05:40 PM
  #33  
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I heard a saying the other day that I could have swore was misused but it actually fits this time around when I say....the punishment fits the crime.


I had to.
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Old Aug 4, 2007 | 05:44 PM
  #34  
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Originally Posted by Wiggum,Aug 4 2007, 07:43 PM
Michael blocked an entire field, and did so blatantly...

Fernando followed team orders, whether they were right or wrong is a different matter...

You can't honestly think they are similiar occurences?
Where do the rules differentiate between blocking a team mate or a different competitor?

I guess FA did not block LH blatantly?

I also stated that the "normal penalty" is 10 spots - care to explain why they only docked him 5?

Following team orders is not an excuse - as the FIA has shown...


(Don't mean to come off as an ass, but you seem like your swinging from Ferrari's nutsack...)
- you did...
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Old Aug 4, 2007 | 05:47 PM
  #35  
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Originally Posted by GPMike,Aug 4 2007, 08:19 PM
LOL!! Looks like Alonso will get zero points out of this race. Hopefully LH wins and puts a chokehold on the championship.
I think FA will get points - only the team will not take any points.

Now the question is, if the 2 McLaren's finished 1&2 but don't take 10&8 points...does the 3rd place car get 10 points or 6? I think it should be 6 but don't know....
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Old Aug 4, 2007 | 06:59 PM
  #36  
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Originally Posted by matrix,Aug 4 2007, 05:47 PM
I think FA will get points - only the team will not take any points.

Now the question is, if the 2 McLaren's finished 1&2 but don't take 10&8 points...does the 3rd place car get 10 points or 6? I think it should be 6 but don't know....
Hmmm, I think you are right.

As for the Constructor's points, I guess whatever McLaren would have earned is not counted and wherever everyone else positions, gets the points associated with that spot. So using your example, if its a 1-2 finish, those 18 points are not added, and the 3rd place car would get 3rd place points and so on down the line it would seem. I guess we shall soon see in a few hours!

And Ferrari should be kicking themselves in the ass right now for screwing up Massa's qualifying. They can potentially gain huge today in the Constructor's, should they pull off a 1-2.
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Old Aug 4, 2007 | 08:30 PM
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McLaren is the new Ferrari.
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Old Aug 4, 2007 | 08:40 PM
  #38  
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This whole thing is an internal McLaren issue and should not be open to ridicule or reprimand by the race stewards. This is ridiculous!!! And what's this crap about not being allowed any Constructor Points???


This is BS. I believe McLaren is under the microscope because of the espionage thing and they will not allow anything to pass now.

Mark
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Old Aug 4, 2007 | 09:51 PM
  #39  
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it seemed to me that it was the teams fault, not Alonso's. which is why they only placed him back to 6th and docked the TEAM from getting any points. The radio communication showed that alonso could not speak because of the countdown being given to him but he didnt know if he had the proper tires. and asked after the countdown if he had the proper ones, they confirmed and off he went. I think hamilton screwed himself by not following team orders prior to the pit stops. and no im not hanging from Mclarens nut sac, im just going based off the evidence that was revealed
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Old Aug 4, 2007 | 09:59 PM
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The full transcript of their decision is as follows:

During the final minutes of qualifying, the car driven by Fernando Alonso remained in its pit stop position at the completion of his pit stop notwithstanding the fact that his teammate Lewis Hamilton was waiting immediately behind him to commence his own pit stop. The delay prevented Hamilton from being able to complete his final flying lap of qualifying.

The Team Principal, together with the team manager and both drivers were called before the Stewards and asked to explain their actions. Reference was made to video and audio evidence. The facts and the explanation given by the team are as follows:

At the commencement of the third period of the qualifying practice it had been agreed within the Vodafone McLaren Mercedes Team ("The Team") that Fernando Alonso would leave the pit exit ahead of Lewis Hamilton in order to benefit from the possibility for purposes of fuel burn allowance of being able to complete an additional lap.

In the event, the car driven by Lewis Hamilton arrived at the pit exit before that of Fernando Alonso and when the pit lane opened he left in front of Alonso. The team required Hamilton by radio communication to allow Alonso to pass in order that he might endeavour to complete his extra lap. Because of the proximity of the Ferrari driven by Kimi Raikkonen, however, Hamilton declined to allow Alonso to pass despite repeated requests from the team to do so.

Reference to the radio communications passing between the team and its two drivers shows that the team told Hamilton at 14:56:44 to "box this lap" and required him to do a "hard in lap" but advised him some 32 seconds later to "slow the pace a little, just lose a couple of seconds before the end of the lap because Fernando is pitting in front of you."

At 14:57:34, just 18 seconds later Alonso was told that when he pitted "we are going to hold you for 20 seconds."

At 14:57:46 Alonso's car arrived at his pit stop position, his tires were changed and the jacks removed just 6 seconds later. The car then remained in position from 14:57:52 to 14:58:12 when the signal known as the "lollipop" was raised indicating that the driver was free to leave.

By this time Hamilton's car had arrived and stopped immediately behind that of Alonso. Alonso, instead of leaving his pit in order that his team-mate Hamilton could complete his pit stop, remained in position for a further 10 seconds. He then left the pit lane in sufficient time to reach the Control Line before the end of qualifying, completed a flying lap in which he set the fastest time and secured pole position.

Because of the delay caused by Alonso, Hamilton was unable to complete his pit stop in time sufficient to enable him also to complete a flying lap.

The team were asked to explain why having indicated to Hamilton that he must stop at his pit on the next lap, they then informed Alonso whilst he was still on the track that when he also pitted on the next lap he would be held for 20 seconds.

The team stated that they frequently give estimates as to duration of pit stop to their drivers before they pit and that the reason the car was in fact held for 20 seconds was that it was being counted down prior to release at a beneficial time regard being given to other cars on the track.

Alonso was asked why he waited for some 10 seconds before leaving the pits after being given the signal to leave. His response was that he was enquiring as to whether the correct set of tires had been fitted to his car. When asked why this conversation did not take place during the 20 second period when his car sat stationary all work on it having been completed, it was stated that it was not possible to communicate by radio because of the countdown being given to him.

Reference to the circuit map shows that at the time Alonso was told he would be held for 20 seconds there were but 4 cars on the circuit, his own and those of Fisichella, Hamilton and Raikkonen. All but Raikkonen entered the pits such that there can have been no necessity to keep Alonso in the pits for 20 seconds waiting for a convenient gap in traffic in which to leave.

The explanation given by Alonso as to why at the expiration of the 20 second period he remained in his pit stop position for a further 10 seconds is not accepted. The Stewards find that he unnecessarily impeded another driver, Hamilton, and as a result he will be penalised by a loss of 5 grid positions.

The explanation given by the team as to why they kept Alonso stationary for 20 seconds after completion of his tire change and therefore delayed Hamilton's own pit stop is not accepted.

The actions of the team in the final minutes of Qualifying are considered prejudicial to the interests of the competition and to the interests of motor sport generally. The penalty to be applied is that such points (if any) in the 2007 Formula One Constructors Championship as accrue to the team as a result of their participation in the 2007 Hungarian Grand Prix will be withdrawn.
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