vader1

[QUOTE=rockville,Jul 19 2009, 11:58 AM] Vader1,

I don't think the G8 plant is low volume.

brockLT1

I agree with your post 100%, where did you pull my name out of thin air from????

I understand how business works, I dont just get off on torque ya know. I am pretty sure I haven't written any posts on hoping GM will succeed. In fact, on other sites, I have written many posts to the contrary, where I have said they should have failed because nine times out of ten they make crappy cars relative to what is out there. I dont like paying taxes for inefficient companies to stay a float because they are "Too Big To Fail."

vader1

[QUOTE=brockLT1,Jul 19 2009, 05:38 PM] I agree with your post 100%, where did you pull my name out of thin air from????

I understand how business works, I dont just get off on torque ya know.

wills2k106

I believe the problem with the G8 to be more a perception thing rather than a business case issue. The G8 was never meant to be a volume leader, sales phenomenon, or save Pontiac. It was meant to be a big full size car that could fill a niche and steal some of the pie that the lesser Chrysler 300 and Dodge Charger filled. I could be wrong but I believe the G8 was only supposed to sell 30,000 units in its first year, it came up a little short selling just north of 20,000 during the first 12 calendar months but sales have actually been on the rise of late and more than 30,000 total units sold in 18 months. It may be the cash on the hood rebates, it may be the "lets buy one of the last Pontiacs" collectors mentality, or it could be that it is a decent car and people are actually picking over Maximas and Avalons. If you need a big people hauler and don't want an suv what are your choices? There is nothing wrong with a niche car as long as it makes money.

With DoD the V8 mileage isn't terrible and the V6 is pretty inline with the competition carpliances. The government takeover has alot of unspoken recomendations, suggestions and under the table dealings (don't close the plant in my district kind of thing) but one thing that is pretty clear is that the perceived gas guzzling nature of the car won't be tolerated since that is what partially put the company in this situation. The business case isn't that bad. Globally GM needs to build more cars on the Zeta platform. The platform was built with global intentions and thus alot of money was spent during initial development, more than billion dollars to be precise. The more they sell (not build, as previous management thought) the more vehicles that can share that cost. They also already make a Chevy version in left hand drive for other parts of the world, and since the platform has already passed US crash and emission standards why not keep bringing it over in low volume? Or why not build a few in the Camaro plant in Oshawa once the demand for that dies down? The additional cost in keeping the car is actually really low. The case is even better if it replaces something already in the lineup and growing long in the tooth, Impala for example. Keeping it here also opens up another avenue that they didn't explore before because of the low volume nature, fleet sales. How many Police Departments, government agencies, and cab companies could use a reliable replacement for the aging fleet of Crown Vics? The LAPD bought one and outfitted it with the obligatory lights and siren for a convention but I am not sure if it ever hit the street. They would have no problem selling a ton of these if they came close to the cost of a government spec Vic.

A decent and semi-profitable car is being killed before its time by politicians because of the perception of old GM lingering over the v8 architecture. In the meantime they are pushing the Volt which will lose money on every sale even at $40,000. GM makes decent cars, they just don't import them and that is really all the recovery plan needs to be, Globalization. Ford is doing it with pretty good success. It takes time to get the development cycles and everything else in line but it can work.

The federal government stepping in here and taking over GM, albeit with a "hands off" role is laughable since they themselves are trillions of dollars in debt and haven't had a balanced budget in I can't remember how long. Hopefully they do better with GM than they do with nearly anything else.

C U AT 9K

I like the G8, been seeing a lot of them floatin around. But I think GM should get into the small car market, and up the quality. May take some time before they get attention, but it could work with the rise in environmentalism. I think Ford sells a decent amount of small cars in Europe.

Oh and I know in Philadelphia, city police are moving away from Crown Vics and they have been using Impala's for city work and Chargers for the highways.

Vik2000

holy shit, this thread contains massive essays.