Is Diesel dead?
Joined: Mar 2002
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From: Ulaanbaatar
I'm increasingly of the opinion diesel vehicles are to be avoided unless they are new and under warranty - and/or they're being bought and run by someone else.
Out of all of my friends and acquaintances, those who are having issues with their cars are the ones driving common-rail, turbocharged diesels. Whether they're BMW, Renaults or Nissans.
I posted a while ago about a conversation I had with a Kubota diesel engineer. He was of the opinion there was diesel time-bomb ready to go off, as the technology in the mega high-pressure fuel pumps and injectors used in contemporary diesel cars wasn't really mature.
If this is the case, then the benefit of increased mpg from a diesel will be worth squat compared to the cost of depreciation as diesel car residual values nose-dive.
Out of all of my friends and acquaintances, those who are having issues with their cars are the ones driving common-rail, turbocharged diesels. Whether they're BMW, Renaults or Nissans.
I posted a while ago about a conversation I had with a Kubota diesel engineer. He was of the opinion there was diesel time-bomb ready to go off, as the technology in the mega high-pressure fuel pumps and injectors used in contemporary diesel cars wasn't really mature.
If this is the case, then the benefit of increased mpg from a diesel will be worth squat compared to the cost of depreciation as diesel car residual values nose-dive.
Thread Starter
Former Moderator
Joined: Jan 2004
Posts: 24,771
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From: Stanmore
Quite right. The numerous diesel problems are getting more widespread attention, from the media and The Telegraph's Honest John in particular.
From the article
From the article
There are also new EU emissions regulations that mean diesel engines require a load of extra equipment to reduce pollutants such as oxides of nitrogen and particulates.
This is estimated to cost manufacturers as much as £1,000 per car to meet EU VI requirements and they are ill disposed towards absorption of such stipends.
These specification changes also reduce diesels' refinement and render them less reliable.
Honest John regularly carries letters about the failure of dual-mass flywheels on diesel cars, which can cost up to £1,500 to put right.
Turbos, particulate filters, glow plugs, exhaust-gas recirculation valve and injection pump failures are becoming more common, and are often caused in part by wrong fuelling with petrol, which causes long-term unseen damage to diesel engines and their ancillaries.
This is estimated to cost manufacturers as much as £1,000 per car to meet EU VI requirements and they are ill disposed towards absorption of such stipends.
These specification changes also reduce diesels' refinement and render them less reliable.
Honest John regularly carries letters about the failure of dual-mass flywheels on diesel cars, which can cost up to £1,500 to put right.
Turbos, particulate filters, glow plugs, exhaust-gas recirculation valve and injection pump failures are becoming more common, and are often caused in part by wrong fuelling with petrol, which causes long-term unseen damage to diesel engines and their ancillaries.
Banned
Joined: May 2002
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From: Survivalist enclave
I remain to be convinced about the diesel time bomb
If it's true, it will be all over the press before long and disgruntled owners will be everywhere
From what I see, that's far from the case atm, despite what Honest John might say
If it's true, it will be all over the press before long and disgruntled owners will be everywhere
From what I see, that's far from the case atm, despite what Honest John might say
Thread Starter
Former Moderator
Joined: Jan 2004
Posts: 24,771
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From: Stanmore
Originally Posted by gaddafi,Feb 8 2010, 05:06 PM
I remain to be convinced about the diesel time bomb
If it's true, it will be all over the press before long and disgruntled owners will be everywhere
From what I see, that's far from the case atm, despite what Honest John might say
If it's true, it will be all over the press before long and disgruntled owners will be everywhere
From what I see, that's far from the case atm, despite what Honest John might say
Unfortunately, it's a case of "wait and see" as the problems probably won't manifest themselves until the cars age a bit.
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Joined: May 2002
Posts: 31,739
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From: Survivalist enclave
"Active regeneration
When the soot loading in the filter reaches a set limit (about 45%) the ECU can make small adjustments to the fuel injection timing to increase the exhaust temperature and initiate regeneration. If the journey's a bit stop/start the regeneration may not complete and the warning light will illuminate to show that the DPF is partially blocked.
It should be possible to start a complete regeneration and clear the warning light simply by driving for 10 minutes or so at speeds greater than 40mph.
If you ignore the light and keep driving in a relatively slow, stop/start pattern soot loading will continue to build up until around 75% when you can expect to see other dashboard warning lights illuminate too. At this point driving at speed alone will not be sufficient and the car will have to go to a dealer for regeneration.
Expensive repairs
If warnings are still ignored and soot loading continues to increase then the most likely outcome will be a new DPF costing around £1000. "
there we go then - revelatory stuff - carry on driving regardless of warning lights and you MAY GET A BIG BILL!
well blow me down, who would have thought that?
as for big bills when cars age, isn't that the norm for all cars?
scare stories make good copy of course
When the soot loading in the filter reaches a set limit (about 45%) the ECU can make small adjustments to the fuel injection timing to increase the exhaust temperature and initiate regeneration. If the journey's a bit stop/start the regeneration may not complete and the warning light will illuminate to show that the DPF is partially blocked.
It should be possible to start a complete regeneration and clear the warning light simply by driving for 10 minutes or so at speeds greater than 40mph.
If you ignore the light and keep driving in a relatively slow, stop/start pattern soot loading will continue to build up until around 75% when you can expect to see other dashboard warning lights illuminate too. At this point driving at speed alone will not be sufficient and the car will have to go to a dealer for regeneration.
Expensive repairs
If warnings are still ignored and soot loading continues to increase then the most likely outcome will be a new DPF costing around £1000. "
there we go then - revelatory stuff - carry on driving regardless of warning lights and you MAY GET A BIG BILL!
well blow me down, who would have thought that?
as for big bills when cars age, isn't that the norm for all cars?
scare stories make good copy of course
Thread Starter
Former Moderator
Joined: Jan 2004
Posts: 24,771
Likes: 311
From: Stanmore
Some links for you,
£1,300 here http://www.fiatforum.com/lets-talk-fiat/18...ate-filter.html
£9k here http://www.honestjohn.co.uk/forum/po...ex.htm?t=70087
£900 here http://www.honestjohn.co.uk/forum/po...ex.htm?t=64204
Buying a 2nd hand diesel is certainly more of a risk than a petrol I'd say.
Dual mass flywheel problems are pretty widespread too http://www.google.co.uk/search?hl=en&rlz=1...&meta=&aq=f&oq=
£1,300 here http://www.fiatforum.com/lets-talk-fiat/18...ate-filter.html
£9k here http://www.honestjohn.co.uk/forum/po...ex.htm?t=70087
£900 here http://www.honestjohn.co.uk/forum/po...ex.htm?t=64204
Buying a 2nd hand diesel is certainly more of a risk than a petrol I'd say.
Dual mass flywheel problems are pretty widespread too http://www.google.co.uk/search?hl=en&rlz=1...&meta=&aq=f&oq=