NoBottleJustThrottle

Hi Chris Long time no talk. How are things?

Anyway, you bring up some good things, and I agree. I think we may have gotten a little side tracked from the original discussion, and I only have myself to blame with the example I gave. I wasn't trying to accuse ASM for replicating a Porsche bumper. It's obviously not a direct replica. Obviously ASM isn't taking market share from Porsche. I was merely showing an example of where even a high end Japanese company such as ASM takes ideas from other companies.

I think what people need to realize is that the replica companies aren't taking other companies' parts and calling them by the original companies name (ex: SEIBON taking a J's Racing hood, and calling it a J's Racing hood). They are taking the design, using cheaper materials, and providing something to the mass market at an affordable price. People should also realize that it wont function, or be nearly at the same level of quality as the original.

People that want the look go replica. People that want the quality, and functionality will go original. In terms of taking market share. I don't think its as big an issue as people make it out to be. People who are in the market for functionality, and quality are usually educated buyers that demand nothing but the best. I don't think that those buyers are going to cheap out and buy replica. Obviously I don't think that it's as black and white as that. I am sure that there is a smaller percentage of buyers that go replica that would have bought original. But again I think the estimate is grossly ballooned.

Orpheus

the bigger problem is that by buying replicas, one hurts the industry, and in the end, just basically hurts the car community.

the reason copyrights and patents exist is not to keep people from being able to buy cheaper parts like seibon and stuff. these laws were meant to encourage innovation.

by buying knock-offs, you discourage companies from creating new products, as they fear their investments may not pay off, as given the choice, some may buy the knock-off instead of the genuine part. in the end, we get less variety for our s2k's.

so, "buy what you want and enjoy it?" irresponsible. you might as well just say it's cool to buy stolen goods too. this is not "small stuff" at all. copyrights and patents are absolutely important. without them, america would not be as it is now at all.

MugenAP2

I support the real thing, people justifying buying fake are just people that like to fake the funk. Same as designer hand bags! People fake the funk, it is sad to say but that is what people like doing for some odd reason all over the world. I can't afford a exotic you don't see me buying a kit car to make it look like one. So basically these companies are just like the china town market!

rev_to_8

If you cannot afford the 'real' deal then just stick with OEM. I understand the price is very high but in the end you know that you have a quality product.

I've said this many time and I will say it again. Replica FTL!

Chris_Lum

[QUOTE=Orpheus,Mar 3 2010, 09:37 AM]the bigger problem is that by buying replicas, one hurts the industry, and in the end, just basically hurts the car community.

the reason copyrights and patents exist is not to keep people from being able to buy cheaper parts like seibon and stuff.

mr flannery77

What's so bad Chris Lum, is that even after post like the one you just made, people somehow still find it hard to understand.

I for one, agree completely.

Mr. Francesco

Go real or go home. That's how I look at it.

These companies aren't doing anything illegal, they are just trying to make a quick buck. Look at how many car companies buy their competitors product, take it apart, and then build their own based upon the other companies ideas and r&d. This happens on a daily basis. Most people can't afford a Ferrari or Porsche, but an auto company can afford to buy two or three Ferrari's and Porsche's for the sake of mass producing a cheaper alternative.

Orpheus

actually, on the contrary, this is highly illegal. however, dealings with entities with ties to foreign countries is probably very hard. chinese companies are notorious.

i am fairly certain that if a us-based company is copying another us-based company's say... hood, they would not be in business long.

i mean, you don't have to be a lawyer to know this is clear copyright infringement.

Mrwilliams

i have a question, i support the authentics. but what do the people who track their car do? for example, what do the people with the amuse front bumper do, track their car anyway? or switch front ends? i ask because it would break my heart if i cracked my $3k bumper within a few hours or less you know?

usdmej

I worked at abercrombie's corporate office for many years actually as a concept designer

so any explanation about ethics would be lost on you


If these companys want to sell parts. They have their own resorces. They should hire designers, their own techs, their own r&d department....make their "own" parts and not steal someone elses work!

"these companies" do have their own designers (mold makers), techs (mold layers), and the same r+d (basically none, making a non-structural body part isn't rocket science). they do make their "own" parts . . . .


What you are comparing is copying vs conterfeiting. One is ethically questionable and the other is illegal. So long as said Aero Company does not sell it as the real deal, and presents it as a replica it's fair game.

thread should have ended here


If there were no copies of the asm bumper, anyone in the market for this 'look' would either have to buy the real thing or not buy at all

which means the only people in the market for an actual ASM bumper are those who only care about exclusivity, not function or good design or value for money or bang for your buck. which makes ASM a producer of nothing more than high novelty items but that is a topic for another thread i guess . .


Squirtle I think if you had a company of your own, then saw someone taking all your hard work and mass producing it for dirt cheap, you would become that "douchebag" you speak of.

it's already been discussed here the high prices are due to shipping costs from Japan and a poor exchange rate. not the blood sweat and tears you theorize about





people shouldn't get so polarized over this topic. IMHO there are some parts that shouldn't be duplicated and some that get hyped up to the point where they need to be copied just so people can see they're not that great/worth the "balllin!" price.

i was truly upset to see a replica Amuse S2K front bumper. that thing was designed in collaboration with Polyphony (think playstation gran turismo) and there was actually a well thought out design philosophy for it. we should be supporting companies that do things like that.

but the ASM front and rear bumpers were just modeled to look like porsche bumpers, and just because they made a cf autoclaved version and shipped it to america doesn't mean you should pay 4 figures for a fiberglass version . . . . to me thats actually a very uninspired design philosophy.


at the end of the day these are just cosmetic body parts people . . . if these "great tuning companies" go out of business it's because they had a bad business model to begin with and couldn't keep in touch with reality. Sure u can blame it on the consumers but in the end they're the ones that keep the scene alive in whatever form they decide