The S2000 too small And you think the Sky is larger? When i saw the Sky at the auto show last year, its dimensions were def smaller. Its based on the Sol, and just by Looking at the Sol you can tell its dimensions are smaller than the S

The C6 vette is of very few americans i like to look at, but i still cant see myself buying one. Yes the paint and interior dynamics stink almost Buick like, and dont forget something like 60% (or more? I forget the figure i read in C&D) of all vettes produced are automatics

A true sports car must be a manual IMO

 

Nope, the sky is small also, I would never own one. They are nice but that would be for the year when dd is gone and im single again

I have no idea how to drive a manual.

 

Small yes, smaller than the S... NO

Oh, and Dunkin Donuts will never go away!!! Viva Iced Mochachinos

 

The problem with this argument is that while GM is closing plants due to overcapacity, they are also shipping their production and efforts to other countries. Buick is HUGE in China (#1 Luxury make ) the 3.4l (BIG POS motor BTW) found in the Cheapuinox and Pontiac Torrent is a Chinese import as well. And while you find plants closing across the country due to overcapacity, production of full size Chevy/GMC trucks continues full steam in Muexico along with the Buick Rendezvous and now (thankfully) defuct Pontiac Asswreck.

Ford Fusion/Milan/Zephyr is Mexico built BTW, so it isn't just GM sending our jobs away. By comparison, if you buy a Honda Accord for instance, you are buying a car that contains 80% domestic content. In fact most Hondas and Acuras are built for the American market using mostly domestic content. Plants are cropping up all over the country providing new jobs while our "Home team" is exporting them for cheaper labor costs.

Supporting import brands is not evil, much to the typical disagreement from pro-domestic fans.

 

BTW, no offense to domestic fans in this thread. I am not a biased "basher" of domestics, I just point out the faults I find.

^ Kia was a conglomeration when it arrived. It was a joint venture between Ford, Mazda, and I believe Hyundai and Mitsubushi. Remember the Sephia? Remember the Sportage? Remember the commercials of the Sephia chasing the Honda Civic around with an oversized odometer strapped to the roof? Proving that a Sephia would go 200,000 miles just like a Civic would?

That was absolutely false. Kia's were like the original Hyundai Excel. Cheap, disposable transportation built to a price. And ALOT of people fell for the Excel, and got burned BADLY. Not so many fell for the Kia's but those who did... whoa boy.

Hyundai/Kia motors have come a long, long way over the years and some of the new cars are quite impressive. They are learning fast from the success of the Japanese imports on "what to do, what not to do" in car building. Hyundai's especially are becoming quite impressive, I'd even go so far as to argue that some Hyundais's are close to the same build quality of Honda / Toyota . Now this is my opinion so YMMV.

I would even go further and claim that Kia's interior build quality and materials are better than some Caddillac's like the CTS and SRX. Once again my opinion, no offense intended.

Kia and Hyundai powerplants? That's a different story. I am NOT a fan of the motors in their products. They are rough, coarse and underpowered. And gas mileage for the V6's especiallly is abysmal in the low 20's range. Funny, because the 4-cyl motors are sourced from Mitsubushi and they quite peppy and durable.

So to answer the above question, Yes Kia's aren't that great, but they are getting better. Not nearly the risk they once were.

 

I came to that conclusion as well. Original, stylish, classic design, but chintzy materials and not layed out very well. Once again, a car built to the $20k price point.

 

I wanted to clairfy, its not just GM, its all the motor companies. The big three namely. I think that by outsourcing production to other continents causes more hurt on the economy here. We will have many more jobles, budget will go down, more money will be spent to assistance/welfare. If these companies (and foreign even!) were offered money to keep and operate the plants as normal I am sure that outsourcing would become dwindled considerably.

I honestly dont mind supporting Import brands. I wont support some of the people who own them, and to me the civics are just crap. I know I will be argued upon that but every single one I have seen has had something wrong with it. Im not talking about one or two, im talking about hundreds. Accords are nice, preludes are nice from what I know about them. Would I own one? Maybe if the right oppurtunity and that was the only available car. However I am not interested in owning a car, I would rather have a new crossover such as pacifica or the smaller SUV like a liberty.

Kias- The difference between my aunts 2002 and my grandmas 2006 is outstanding. Kia finally freaking realized how to get it right! Well a little bit. I find their rio disposable and a cheaply made car. The sedona is very uncomfortable ride which I dont care for, however that is me.

BTW my dad has one of those 3.4l buicks. His car gets better gas mileage than mine!!!!! 38 mpg and mine gets 30 with a 4cyl

 

The 3.4 was known as "The Bonecrusher' when it came out in the mid-eighties. Sure it's SOMEWHAT efficient, but it goes down in history as one of the roughest, most unrefined motors in history. Used to find them in anything from Pontiac GrandAM's to these things...





BTW Allynbayleigh I am not downing your opinions. For what its worth, I used to have a friend with a 91 Saturn SL1. She drove it for 100k plus miles and it held up pretty well. And she did absolutely nothing to take car of it.

Saturn use to do things on their own before they became "just another GM car" It's cool if you like them.

 

BTW, did you guys hear the latest from GM? They are making a buyout offer to their employees. A deal with Delphi & UAW to slash union work force. Yep basically buying out the employees and offering early retirement to get them off the nipple so to speak.

But still doesn't account for poor design. They might just bounce back smaller and leaner. Lets hope its not too late since the company credit is already in the toilet. It will be interesting to see what their strategic gameplan would be for the coming years.

 

That was an essential move in order for them to survive... Actually sounds like Bankruptcy would be beneficial to rebuilding the company back to profitability. They want to cut 30,000 employees by 2008.

Ouch. This should not be happening.