^^^
I do not know how your high school teachers were, but it would be ridiculous if University professors went about teaching the same as High School teachers do.

That's what high school teachers do, they teach. They introduce you to new subjects and they [teachers] are educated in college on a variety of subjects that they will then relay to students. Teachers aren't a professional in any subject.

College professors don't teach. A student signs up for their class and the instructor goes in-depth on a certain subject and instructs what to do in this area of study, because they love that subject. They are a professional on that subject.

If you are looking for a university to hold your hand and make a subject relate to you, instead of making yourself relate to the subject, then you're in college for the wrong reason man.

 

First of all, I disagree with your thought that teachers aren't "professional" in any subject. I'd say my HS business teacher who had a MBA was about as qualified to teach that subject as any college professor.

Second, I'm not looking for somoene to hold my hand. If you're telling me a professors job is to say "hey, here are all my thoughts on XYZ and now you figure out how to wrap your head around that".... that's just wrong. To say it's not the job of any teacher, at any level, to try relating the material to his pupils is ridiculous.

The primary point I'm trying to make is that most professors know much, much more about the theory of what they teach than how that theory works outside the bubble of the academic world... which is why 95% of what you learn in college is propoganda, useless, or just flat out wrong.

 

Looks like ocmusicjunkie doesn't like most college professors.

I didn't see any or have any qualms with any of my professors. My business profs were conservative but didn't force it down our throats and my humanities were (mostly) liberal and didn't force it down anyone's throats either.

I had some stupid professors (didn't know what the hell they were doing), but I could count them on one hand.

Teaching in college is A LOT different than teaching in HS. I would have to say that you are more involved with relaying theory and having to discuss higher level ideas to a more accepting group of students.

In HS you basically learn how to "teach." There are workshops and strategies that make up about 50% of a teacher's time. A lot of the teachers I know (and I know a lot of them) don't delve that deep into theory. They teach fundamentals; the basis for greater ideas. Yeah, they know what they're talking about, but MOST don't have an advanced degree in their subject, if anything they have it in education. (M.A. in Ed. or Ph.d in Ed.) Does not having an advanced degree mean you don't know what you are talking about? No, but it sure helps.

However I know a few teachers who do teach both college and HS. I don't know how they do it but they do. I'd say around 1-2% do.

Now, I think teaching HS is a lot more demanding and is more difficult, and definitely more self-less. Depending on where one is a professor it can be difficult or not. But with the latter, you don't have to deal with disruptions, grading every week (depending on what and where you teach) and having to "dumb down" lectures. People in college are grown ups and if they don't get something they can come to office hours.

In general professors teach because they love what they teach. They might do research, they might love to relay information. They are *gasp* passionate about ideas. Now there might be some bad apples, and some unfortunate cases where being open minded isn't a virtue, but that doesn't mean we should demonize all 95% of them.

Most everything I learned in college I can relate to the real world. It wasn't the professor's job to do that for me. They are definitely NOT right on everything, but they and my college experience helped me see things in ways I could have never imagined.

 

woah. Just stumbled over this - I'm usually not in this forum.

coupla things.
1. College profs can usually make more $ outside of academia than inside of it. What I get in exchange for less $ (I could probably double my salary if I went into private practice), is time. I get two months off in the summer - although it's often spent doing research and prepping for the next semester.
2. Typically, we cannot use data collected in undergrad classrooms, because it's not high enough quality, and there are ethical issues with that (basic rule is that if you do not sign an informed consent form when filling forms, it can't be used for research). We do use undergrads as participants, but it's outside of class.
3. Not to be snobby, but the writing done at the undergrad level for classes cannot be used for scholarly journals. It's just not of the expected level to be published (I publish in journals, and also am a reviewer for several scholarly journals, and I reject about 90% of the manuscripts sent to me for publication).

 

woah. Just stumbled over this - I'm usually not in this forum.

coupla things.
1. College profs can usually make more $ outside of academia than inside of it. What I get in exchange for less $ (I could probably double my salary if I went into private practice), is time. I get two months off in the summer - although it's often spent doing research and prepping for the next semester.
2. Typically, we cannot use data collected in undergrad classrooms, because it's not high enough quality, and there are ethical issues with that (basic rule is that if you do not sign an informed consent form when filling forms, it can't be used for research). We do use undergrads as participants, but it's outside of class.
3. Not to be snobby, but the writing done at the undergrad level for classes cannot be used for scholarly journals. It's just not of the expected level to be published (I publish in journals, and also am a reviewer for several scholarly journals, and I reject about 90% of the manuscripts sent to me for publication). While I have undergrads on my research teams, and many get their names on conference presentations, I have had only one paper in which I have gotten in that had undergrads on it - and they didn't do any of the writing.

Are there bad profs? Absolutely. Do some recycle their material year after year? Yes, and I know some. Are some more interested in their research/own life/retirement than students? Yes, and I know some of those too. I'd be careful of generalizing that "all (insert group here) are (insert negative stereotype here)." Most of the profs I know are dedicated in teaching their students (and that's why we get mad, frustrated, etc - we want your best), and go out of their way to help. We mark up your papers to make you better writers, and personally, I don't care if any one student loves me or hates me (as much as I'd like be on good terms with everyone), it's my job to teach. So as long as I can get the student to learn, what they think of me is secondary.

So yes, some of us are horrible teachers, people, etc. But we choose this profession because we enjoy teaching, enjoy research, and enjoy the academic culture. The day I stop enjoying teaching is the day I retire, and most profs I know feel the same way.

 

sorry for the double post - I must've hit the wrong button.

 

The $ factor largely depends on what type of professor you are. If you're teaching bio-engineering or something that is very technical and requires lots of "how-to" knowledge that could be valuable to a private enterprise, I'm certain this is true.

My attacks on professors were mostly directed toward English, Poli-Sci, Econ and Business teachers- the ones I spent the most time with. More technical trades have less room for people who are all talk and less substance.

I also agree that 99% of undergrad work couldn't be published. I do know, however, there is some that could be and has been stolen. A good friend of mine got a full ride to Cal, then Harvard as a grad student. She had two of her undergrad papers basically plagiarized and published by professors under their own names. It's not ethical, but it does happen.

 

You're right - the $ depends on the field. English profs usually don't make a whole lot outside of academia; poli sci acutally has high potential, and Econ/biz typically take a pay cut to work at universities.

And I'm sorry about your friend - yes, there are a few stellar undergrads who can publish, and I've heard of ideas being stolen. I also know of profs who demand a minor change on a phd student's dissertation, so when it gets pubished, they demand their name gets put on it because they made a 'contribution' to the paper. It is not ethical, and while it might be a lot of work, sometimes it's worth bringing up charges. It gets me angry to hear of people stealing other's work - it's not right, it shouldn't happen, is unethical, and sadly, yes it does happen.

 

I posted here, Vintage and Socal

Thanks again for the help

 

see all the problems you've caused Andre?