Anyone Read the LA Times article on Who Shot TUpac?
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From: State of Confusion
[QUOTE]Originally posted by EvoVII
[B]Anyone ever see tradin places the movie? If anyone has seen it, I dont have to go into detail to the point I was trying to make! Like I said, I dont expect many people to understand, but if you had the oppurtunity to walk in his shoes, how long would you think you would last? The man got shot 5 times in the lobby in Times Square, and lived to tell about it. He excused himself from the hospital just 3 hours after surgery due to fear that someone would finish the job in the hospital room. That was his life, and he knew that he didn't have much time left. After just finishing a movie (I think it was juice), the director told him to some extent that "You are gonna have a great future in the next 10 years", Tupac replied, "I don't think I will be here in 10 years", knowing that his lifestyle would get him killed, but ya know what,
[B]Anyone ever see tradin places the movie? If anyone has seen it, I dont have to go into detail to the point I was trying to make! Like I said, I dont expect many people to understand, but if you had the oppurtunity to walk in his shoes, how long would you think you would last? The man got shot 5 times in the lobby in Times Square, and lived to tell about it. He excused himself from the hospital just 3 hours after surgery due to fear that someone would finish the job in the hospital room. That was his life, and he knew that he didn't have much time left. After just finishing a movie (I think it was juice), the director told him to some extent that "You are gonna have a great future in the next 10 years", Tupac replied, "I don't think I will be here in 10 years", knowing that his lifestyle would get him killed, but ya know what,
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From: Dana Point, CA
Originally posted by EvoVII
I have been away for a day, but now I am back to follow up this thread, and what has been previously said: First of all, yeah, he was part of the bloods, a "gang" if you may, but he did what he had to do to survive, he wasn't very much affiliated as them, but used them for their services such as bodyguards, and who isn't part of a gang in their own respect? George Bush is part of a gang called Congress, and he is a gang leader, do you think he should be known as a hero for destroying Nations, and raising taxes, etc? Tupac Shakur was the greatest POET of our time, as he said a couple years ago, "I came from the gutter, and I am still here", now his childhood does not condone some felonies that he has done, but what has he done that was so different from Malcolm X? He was opressed, just like many black people at the time, I mean, the guy was cuffed for Jay walking... Now ya know what, some people would never fathom what he did, but I will assure you that everything was justified, so do not mock someone beyond the grave because he cant defend himelf, but I can speak upon him to keep his legend alive... in one of his songs, it says "You could never understand till you trade places", and I think that is why some can not comprehend what he has done, but put yourself in his shoes, and out of the dome that you call "normal life", and you would do anything you could to survive.... He stood and died for his cause and is in many ways a Martyr... I can go on and on, but I am tired of writing about something many people will never understand, so I will leave you with this: There were 2 sides to Tupac Shakur, the ying and the yang if you may, remember him not for his faults, but for his triumphs over adversity.... wanna know what his favourite song is? The theme from Les Miserables...
I have been away for a day, but now I am back to follow up this thread, and what has been previously said: First of all, yeah, he was part of the bloods, a "gang" if you may, but he did what he had to do to survive, he wasn't very much affiliated as them, but used them for their services such as bodyguards, and who isn't part of a gang in their own respect? George Bush is part of a gang called Congress, and he is a gang leader, do you think he should be known as a hero for destroying Nations, and raising taxes, etc? Tupac Shakur was the greatest POET of our time, as he said a couple years ago, "I came from the gutter, and I am still here", now his childhood does not condone some felonies that he has done, but what has he done that was so different from Malcolm X? He was opressed, just like many black people at the time, I mean, the guy was cuffed for Jay walking... Now ya know what, some people would never fathom what he did, but I will assure you that everything was justified, so do not mock someone beyond the grave because he cant defend himelf, but I can speak upon him to keep his legend alive... in one of his songs, it says "You could never understand till you trade places", and I think that is why some can not comprehend what he has done, but put yourself in his shoes, and out of the dome that you call "normal life", and you would do anything you could to survive.... He stood and died for his cause and is in many ways a Martyr... I can go on and on, but I am tired of writing about something many people will never understand, so I will leave you with this: There were 2 sides to Tupac Shakur, the ying and the yang if you may, remember him not for his faults, but for his triumphs over adversity.... wanna know what his favourite song is? The theme from Les Miserables...
I'm throwing a flag for this. What kind of cruddy analogy are you trying to draw here? The elected President of the United States is akin to Tupac Shakur? You must be kidding.
Furhter, to say that "everything he did was justified" or "he died for his cause" is a crock.
Yes, he was born poor. Yes, he was born into terrible conditions. You know what? A lot of us are. The difference is in how you conduct yourself as an adult. He knew the difference between right and wrong. He know that the "thug life" and that culture was bad for him, bad for his community and bad for his family. Yet even after he had the means and money to change that aspect of his life he didn't. And don't even think about giving me any BS about how he "kept it real". That's a cop out too. I was born dirt poor. I'm not black, but I'm the grandchild of four immigrants to this country and I'm brown. I am the first member of my entire family to go to, let alone graduate with honors from University. I used my gifts (my mind) to pull myself out of that situation. As did my sister after me. Tupac chose to use his gifts (poetry and music) to perpetuate the glory of the Thug lifestlye. One of those choices was prodcutive, the other wasn't.
I continue to "keep it real" because I stay involved with my entire family. It doesn't matter that I know live "behind the Orange curtain" in an overwhelmingly white area (RSM). I visit my family in Wimington, San Pedro, and Carson. They visit me. I help them when they're down and they inspire me to keep pushing so that my kids have it one step easier than I did and so forth.
I may not be making any sense here but my point is this" Instead of using his fortune, fame, and influence to denounce gang life, drug culture, violence and crime, Tupac continued to glorify it. No, not in every song and perhaps that's what makes his death and life choices that much more bitter. Some of his poetry and music clearly shows me that he knew the difference between right and wrong and he knew that he was in a position to influence millions. Yet he'd turn right back around and glorify the Thug life.
None of us can be sure why he died. Without finding and bringing his killer to justice we'll only be able to speculate that. What I am pretty sure about is that he didn't die trying to bring his people up or positively influence the people around him.
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From: Dana Point, CA
Originally posted by EvoVII
he was a true soldier in every aspect of the word....
he was a true soldier in every aspect of the word....
Webster defines soldier as:"1 a : one engaged in military service and especially in the army b : an enlisted man or woman c : a skilled warrior". Tupac was not a sodier. Not in any aspect of the word. He committed his life to making money for himself. Not to serving any army. Moreover, the fact that he survived an assasination attempt makes him either incredibly lucky, incredibly tough, or a combo. of the two but not a skilled warrior.
You want to define Tupac with one word? Try this. Gangster. Webster defines gangster as: "a member of a gang of criminals".
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From: 49th Parallel
He was a soldier, not fighting for some army, but fighting for a race, and what he stood for. (A coward dies 1000 times, but a soldier dies but once, that is the definition of a real soldier) He made a stand, by shooting a police officer in Atlanta, and it wasn't because of gang banging, it was because of self defense, and he was found innocent in that trial. He has a military mentality above anything else. A line that I frquently use, and I think perfectly applies to this situation is that "Some people aren't meant to grow and flourish, they are here to plant the seed" which I think perfectly states Tupac's mission in life. And my George Bush analogy was very just in many ways: Ya know, Tupac has always mentioned getting into politics and running for a supreme leadership role after his song career was over, in his last interview officially recorded he said that thug life was over, and that he wanted to move on (Exit Tupac Enter Makaveli), but never really got the chance too. So I also propose this question while on the topic: If tupac was alive today, and ran for president would he win? Well, he has my vote, because he is the epitamy of what it means to be a born leader. We have all done things in life that we regret, I mean I can recall a few things although to a lesser extent that I have regretted, but for some strange reason his music speaks to me, I can't really explain it, and he has helped me get through some tough times and has taught me many life lessons. Role Model? Probably not, but inspiration and courage to learn from? Definitely.... If we could separate the good from the bad, you will see a tender soul lying beneath the tattoos, bandanas, and rough exterior... you just have to look deep enough
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From: Dana Point, CA
[QUOTE]Originally posted by EvoVII
[B]He was a soldier, not fighting for some army, but fighting for a race, and what he stood for. (A coward dies 1000 times, but a soldier dies but once, that is the definition of a real soldier)
[B]He was a soldier, not fighting for some army, but fighting for a race, and what he stood for. (A coward dies 1000 times, but a soldier dies but once, that is the definition of a real soldier)
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From: 49th Parallel
No Da Hapa, speak your mind, and if you have something to say by all means say it, we are here to express our opinions right? Feel free, I will not feel offended in anyway, we just have a difference of opinion, that doesn't mean that my opinion is the right one or vice versa......
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From: Chicago
Please. "Trading Places" was a movie, a comedy at that. You can pretend it was real. I won't. People make their own choices. A thief doesn't steal because he/she is hungry, they steal because they don't want to work for it. You don't sell drugs to bring happiness to people, you sell drugs to make money, and defray the cost of your own habit.
You can pretend Tupac was a saint, and white people just don't understand. But get this: he was killed by people who knew him better than you or I. A man's character is decided by the company he keeps.
>If we could separate the good from the bad, you will see a
>tender soul lying beneath the tattoos, bandanas, and rough
>exterior... you just have to look deep enough
Yeah, if we could separate the good from the bad, there would be a core of goodness there, perhaps. But there would also be one hell of a pile of bad we would have to dispose of somehow. My mother always used to tell me "the road to hell is paved with good intentions." I think it applies here.
Many people in history have had good points, but we remember them for their bad. I am sure Hitler was pretty decent to work under, and probably had big plans for happiness once the war was over. Sad truth is, he was an evil animal. His sunny insides do not offset his evil. Compare Tupac to like souls, not to Gandhi or MLK, Jr. Those two will live forever in history as two of the finest humans ever to have walked this earth. Tupac will be a trivia question for maybe ten more years, as the gangsta thug rapper who reaped what he sowed.
I am only posting because of this:"Feel free, I will not feel offended in anyway." I am not trying to attack you
You can pretend Tupac was a saint, and white people just don't understand. But get this: he was killed by people who knew him better than you or I. A man's character is decided by the company he keeps.
>If we could separate the good from the bad, you will see a
>tender soul lying beneath the tattoos, bandanas, and rough
>exterior... you just have to look deep enough
Yeah, if we could separate the good from the bad, there would be a core of goodness there, perhaps. But there would also be one hell of a pile of bad we would have to dispose of somehow. My mother always used to tell me "the road to hell is paved with good intentions." I think it applies here.
Many people in history have had good points, but we remember them for their bad. I am sure Hitler was pretty decent to work under, and probably had big plans for happiness once the war was over. Sad truth is, he was an evil animal. His sunny insides do not offset his evil. Compare Tupac to like souls, not to Gandhi or MLK, Jr. Those two will live forever in history as two of the finest humans ever to have walked this earth. Tupac will be a trivia question for maybe ten more years, as the gangsta thug rapper who reaped what he sowed.
I am only posting because of this:"Feel free, I will not feel offended in anyway." I am not trying to attack you
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From: 49th Parallel
Well, it looks like I won't sway anbody's opinions with my dialect, and I have said a little bit of what i had to say throughout the thread, but it really is a very complex matter that can take days to really fully explain, its a love hate relationship, and many people love to hate him, which is fine by me, but don't remember him as a "gang-banger" just remember him as a lost soul if anything else....
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From: houston
To all those who consider Tupac a bad person: Who are you to judge him? By doing so you imply that you are perfect and can speak on him in such negative manner without being a hyprocrite. He is a hero to alot of people, just because you are incapable of understanding his morality and ideals doesnt give you the right to demean him and make him "appear" unworthy of the halo/crown that his people have placed upon him.