why do rich people want to keep making money
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From: Ventura, California, USA
Originally Posted by dyhppy,Oct 31 2007, 04:16 AM
dont get your panties in a bunch.
but i have to say, I'm so tired of hearing you sanctimonious self righteous jerks talk about work hard=deserve wealth. YOU may have gotten lucky and it appeared that your hard work earned you your living, but what would you say to the multitudes of other who work hard if not harder than you and earn less.
but i have to say, I'm so tired of hearing you sanctimonious self righteous jerks talk about work hard=deserve wealth. YOU may have gotten lucky and it appeared that your hard work earned you your living, but what would you say to the multitudes of other who work hard if not harder than you and earn less.
If you work hard and attain wealth you do deserve it. Look at Bill Gates, Steve Jobs, and the founders of Google. They all took chances and won.
If you work hard and are in school/training until the age of 30 or so making little to no money and putting in 80 or more hours/week from the age of 18 or so studying/working....and you then have a skill that few others have don't you deserve to be paid well based on supply and demand?
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Originally Posted by vtec9,Oct 31 2007, 08:12 AM
dyhppy, you need to read some econ books, brother.. You're looking this from the completely wrong angle and not addressing the real problem.
It has been proven that our welfare state has led to a huge decline in philanthropy. Voluntary organizations, charities, and donations flourished before it was unconstitutionally turned into a government function. As the government steals more and more money from citizens and the private sector through tax increases and monetary inflation to fund the welfare state, the people have less resources available for charitable donations. Voluntary social services have always been more effective.
This doesn't even touch on the fact that government sponsored welfare breeds helplessness and dependency, leads to subordination, and undermines personal responsibility.
What do you think is going to benefit society more.. Bill Gates giving billions of dollars to his own and other charities that directly benefit the lives of others, or the government squandering and misplacing money, and creating a class of dependent misfits?
It has been proven that our welfare state has led to a huge decline in philanthropy. Voluntary organizations, charities, and donations flourished before it was unconstitutionally turned into a government function. As the government steals more and more money from citizens and the private sector through tax increases and monetary inflation to fund the welfare state, the people have less resources available for charitable donations. Voluntary social services have always been more effective.
This doesn't even touch on the fact that government sponsored welfare breeds helplessness and dependency, leads to subordination, and undermines personal responsibility.
What do you think is going to benefit society more.. Bill Gates giving billions of dollars to his own and other charities that directly benefit the lives of others, or the government squandering and misplacing money, and creating a class of dependent misfits?
i majored in economics. and i find that arguing with people about politcs that come from liberal arts backrounds or poli sci is pointless. all they can see is the idealistic side and not the reality of it.
they just dont understand the economic model and the huge inefficiencys associated with wealth ceilings and price floors.
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From: Biloxi, MS
Originally Posted by s2000raj,Oct 31 2007, 08:10 AM
If you work hard and attain wealth you do deserve it. Look at Bill Gates, Steve Jobs, and the founders of Google. They all took chances and won.
It sounds like you've read too much of the communist manifesto to me dyhppy. It all sounds great in theory, but doesn't work in practice (and yes i know thats an overused statement). Is our system perfect? No, definetly not, but its the best out there.
Your comment about individual thinking isn't very well thought out, and by reading just a few economic books you'd surely recognize that. Socialism nullifies individualized thinking and incentive to improve. Individualized thinking (the entrepreneur) is what furthers this economy and anyone can do it and make great wealth from their own ideas.
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Originally Posted by trainwreck,Oct 31 2007, 09:04 AM
i agree that dyhppy just doesnt get it.
i majored in economics. and i find that arguing with people about politcs that come from liberal arts backrounds or poli sci is pointless. all they can see is the idealistic side and not the reality of it.
they just dont understand the economic model and the huge inefficiencys associated with wealth ceilings and price floors.
i majored in economics. and i find that arguing with people about politcs that come from liberal arts backrounds or poli sci is pointless. all they can see is the idealistic side and not the reality of it.
they just dont understand the economic model and the huge inefficiencys associated with wealth ceilings and price floors.
Also, by capping wealth to an artificial maximum, you are creating disincentives. I think he called it "meritocracy," whereby individuals should be allowed to achieve what they are capable of without trivial interference.
I think dyhyppy's point of view is socialist in nature, for better or for worse..
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Originally Posted by trainwreck,Oct 31 2007, 09:04 AM
i agree that dyhppy just doesnt get it.
i majored in economics. and i find that arguing with people about politcs that come from liberal arts backrounds or poli sci is pointless. all they can see is the idealistic side and not the reality of it.
they just dont understand the economic model and the huge inefficiencys associated with wealth ceilings and price floors.
i majored in economics. and i find that arguing with people about politcs that come from liberal arts backrounds or poli sci is pointless. all they can see is the idealistic side and not the reality of it.
they just dont understand the economic model and the huge inefficiencys associated with wealth ceilings and price floors.
yeah i get what you're saying, however economics is a social science. and not everything can be quantified or simplified to graphs. economics is not law, and there are and only have been a few economic systems put in practice since our short time here on earth. there are probably (idealism ahead) way more different modes of workable economics that we can't even imagine today...
...and of course we can't deny certain economic truths, and progress needs to happen... but people's suffering also needs to be taken into account.
i think there can be a strong dialectic between the two and that the American capitalistic system is a perfect catalyst for that...
i think it is 100% viable to have a strong working class and a respectable upper class if it weren't for materialism.
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still haven't finished reading, but want to say,
2020, did you seriously try to insult me like that? how do you have any grounds to say that credibly?
no one is saying that the rich have to stop working. BUT when they work and make money, they don't get to keep it. if they love working, they should work for the accomplishment of it. how cool would a guy look if he continued to work just for the sport of it instead of the money. he would be a hero in a way.
bottomline, our society ought to be more civic minded, to benefit the whole.
2020, did you seriously try to insult me like that? how do you have any grounds to say that credibly?
no one is saying that the rich have to stop working. BUT when they work and make money, they don't get to keep it. if they love working, they should work for the accomplishment of it. how cool would a guy look if he continued to work just for the sport of it instead of the money. he would be a hero in a way.
bottomline, our society ought to be more civic minded, to benefit the whole.
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From: Albuquerque, NM
"rich" is a point of view, but from my point of view, being rich would be to have seven figures in liquid assets. Aren't people who fit that description some of the most philantropic people in the world, in terms of the percentage of their income that they donate? ON TOP OF the higher tax that they pay than the middle class?
dyhppy, how philantropic are you?
In the words of a notorious pedophile... "if you wanna change the world, take a look at yourself, and make a change..."
Edit: Oh yeah, I forgot to mention, there are a few countries I can think of that would love to have you as a model citizen. But the US was founded on ideals of freedom from religious and economic oppression, which you propose. The world is a big place; feel free to live in a country that better suits your ideals.
dyhppy, how philantropic are you?
In the words of a notorious pedophile... "if you wanna change the world, take a look at yourself, and make a change..."
Edit: Oh yeah, I forgot to mention, there are a few countries I can think of that would love to have you as a model citizen. But the US was founded on ideals of freedom from religious and economic oppression, which you propose. The world is a big place; feel free to live in a country that better suits your ideals.
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Originally Posted by dyhppy,Oct 31 2007, 05:49 PM
BUT when they work and make money, they don't get to keep it. if they love working, they should work for the accomplishment of it.
WTF are people teaching in schools these days?