Steve, it's jarring every time I see David's car on your sig....

 

Not sure why you're upset by my response or think it's unhelpful -- I actually think it's both more correct and more helpful than your post. You made a absolute statement, which I'll paraphrase:

Your car will understeer if you don't run a rear bar.
Your car will have neutral balance if you run the stock rear bar.
Your car will oversteer if you run a stiffer rear bar.

...Which I again say may be incorrect given that his spring rates have changed. That's all that can be said without knowing his spring rates and/or driving his car. Your statements presuppose a baseline which doesn't apply here. The original poster should tell us whether he likes his car's balance, and we can give input on proposed changes based on that.

Edit: Since I'm being called out for being unhelpful (again, unfairly in my opinion), I'll elaborate. Take off the rear bar, drive without one for a while, and decide whether you're happy with the car's balance. If you are, you're done without spending a dime (other than if you pay someone to remove the bar). If you think the car's too pushy, reduce the rear toe-in (if you're running any) and see if that helps. If the car's still too pushy, find a junkyard rear bar and install that. If the car's still too pushy, then something's pretty weird with the setup or you like a really loose car.

Or, if you're not sure if it's loose or pushy, or aren't sure what those terms mean, just take off the rear bar and don't worry about it.

 

Yeah, I'm torn over whether I should show the car I autocross (David's Elise), the car I own but don't currently autocross (my S2000), or a car I used to autocross but no longer own (Boxster, 968, S2000). Since the whole premise of the signature is that I race, I opted for the first option.

 

Yeah and get the $hit slug at you in person

You guys are harsh, someone out there (from some strange place) liked this kit enough to spend that kind of money lol, at least this guys was smart enough to pick it up already done at a fraction of the cost, of course after paying to have it removed he wont be saving

And Peddle Faster /RT are both right in their own context. Figuring out what spring rates are on your coilovers will be a helpful factor in deciding which year of rear sway bar to run as 00-01 02-03 04-05 and so on all will have a different tension/handling attribute. trying to keep as close to a 50/50 balance at the limit is what I prefer, if that’s your goal then keep that in mind when selecting.

 

You've purchased a piece of PacNW history. Get hazed in person @ Applebees (it's actually a harmless bunch) and I'll buy your first beer.

 

This is where I may disagree with RT/Peddal faster. Regardless if not having a rear sway bar "works" and could possibly be made to be balanced at the limit of tire adhesion, it still going to cause IMOP excessive rear body roll, removing the direct/precision handing of the car, it will also cause much more wheel suspension movement causing the rear wheel spec to move in/out of geometrical extremes adding to the unpredictability in handing of the car. This is a modification that I would never consider, I also have a year of S2000 with the stiffest rear sway bar and most ass happy out of the bunch in stock form. I have dialed that out in my set up but would still prefer this over a car that pushes.

 

[QUOTE=lig,Oct 22 2009, 08:51 AM]

You've purchased a piece of PacNW history.

 

You need some additional hazing!

 

Junky, your statement is also overly general. I agree that there's such thing as a car that's too softly sprung. However, without knowing Gerald's spring rates, we don't know for sure if his car will be too soft without a rear bar. There's also actually such thing as a car that's too stiffly sprung as well, so adding more rear bar isn't always a good idea even if more rotation is desired -- it may make the car feel more precise, but it may also compromise rear grip and/or drivability.

Unless a car's setup or handling are utterly screwed up, in my opinion the best way to make setup adjustments is incrementally, relative to the current setup and behavior.