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I'm NA these days with roughly stock set up, ie header with heat shield, intake. Although I have blocked the coolant to the intake manifold and running Hondata thermal gasket and also a large capacity FB radiator and sitting in stop in go traffic for a few hours earlier this summer in 90 degree temps with the AC on I saw my coolant temp get up to 237F before turning off the AC, which then it proceeded to drop 20F almost immediately. I was surprised, but clearly the AC in these extreme situations is the problem on this car. After getting the car moving again with some kind of airflow it wasn't as much an issue, but i've learned that in this situation cycling the AC on/off once in a wile is not a bad idea. Fortunately I don't normally find myself in these conditions with this car.
Wait a sec, your oil is 250f after casually driving around for a few min WITH an oil cooler. Correct me if I'm wrong but that sounds way high to me. I could see that with you beating on it and no cooler. But with a cooler and normal driving. That just sounds high to me.
So, I do see 250F while driving normally on the street in 90-100F ambient, but that's with redlining (i tend to beat on it). The typical ranges in these summer months once warmed up and driving around ranges from about 230-250F and yes, that's with a cooler. I agree that this does seem high. However, when i had the oil cooler in the bumper before (smaller cooler with ducting) it would get to like 300F on the track with like an 80F ambient before the 3rd lap (with first lap being a cooldown lap). This was also with my oil temp and pressure sensors mounted to a sandwich plate underneath the header and probably getting heat soaked. After getting a bigger oil cooler and moving it to the front of the radiator i moved the sensors to be in line with the incoming oil to the oil cooler and i have noticed that it does get cooler now, this could be because it's getting more air (albeit still blocked by the heat exchanger) or it could be that the sensors are not getting heat soaked from the header or a combination. It may be worth noting that I also have removed the stock oil cooler and have jumpered the coolant lines to the oil cooler.
I completely agree that my temps (both oil and coolant) are abnormally hot. I have not encountered anyone who has as many cooling modifications as I do and still has trouble. They were hot with the first engine that i blew and they are still hot with the second. This is why I am re-evaluating my radiator and cooler orientation and will be wrapping the headers.
Originally Posted by s2000Junky
I'm NA these days with roughly stock set up, ie header with heat shield, intake. Although I have blocked the coolant to the intake manifold and running Hondata thermal gasket and also a large capacity FB radiator and sitting in stop in go traffic for a few hours earlier this summer in 90 degree temps with the AC on I saw my coolant temp get up to 237F before turning off the AC, which then it proceeded to drop 20F almost immediately. I was surprised, but clearly the AC in these extreme situations is the problem on this car. After getting the car moving again with some kind of airflow it wasn't as much an issue, but i've learned that in this situation cycling the AC on/off once in a wile is not a bad idea. Fortunately I don't normally find myself in these conditions with this car.
It's good to know im not the only one. I just had my AC evacuated and recharged at a shop with a vacuum as i was worried something was blocked. It is blowing cold but taxing the system.
So last night I went to work on the car to try to dismount the oil cooler and lay it flat in the bumper to test my theory. However, after looking at the spacing there was no way i was going to be able to do this without removing the SOS heat exchanger and oil cooler first which meant taking off the bumper completely and refilling both the oil and the heat exchanger. I decided instead to remove the bumper and look at the vmount potential with the oil cooler and the heat exchanger. I noticed that the evaporator? canister is in the way as are the AC lines. I was able to unmount the canister and sensors and re-arrange the lines and the bracket so that the canister sat flush with the ac condensor and allowed for enough space to Vmount my massive 25row oil cooler. This may impact the ac functionality, but will allow me to vmount the exchanger and oil cooler as well as move the oil cooler to the front and away from the radiator which should achieve the following:
more airflow around the oil cooler and heat exchanger through to the radiator
more airflow through and around the cooler (bringing it forward instead of behind the heat exchanger)
less oil cooler airflow through the radiator (oil cooler is angled up, toward the engine bay and is further away from the radiator)
Less flow through the heat exchanger (not ideal, but at this point my IATs have less to cool compared to my oil and ECT)
I am trying to copy Josserman's setup, it seems to have worked for him so fingers crossed:
I also noticed that much of the foam gasket material that i used to close off the radiator fans had blown out due to driving. I am going to get a more snug foam and fill it in. To the people who said putting a thin strip of foam in the shroud was a bad thing, can someone please elaborate why? I agree that it limits airflow where the foam is, but the total area limited would be small in comparison to the overall size of the radiator. What other solutions would I have for sealing off the fans with the face of the radiator? (the fans mount to the shroud but i can't take off the shroud completely).
So, I do see 250F while driving normally on the street in 90-100F ambient, but that's with redlining (i tend to beat on it). The typical ranges in these summer months once warmed up and driving around ranges from about 230-250F and yes, that's with a cooler. I agree that this does seem high. However, when i had the oil cooler in the bumper before (smaller cooler with ducting) it would get to like 300F on the track with like an 80F ambient before the 3rd lap (with first lap being a cooldown lap). This was also with my oil temp and pressure sensors mounted to a sandwich plate underneath the header and probably getting heat soaked. After getting a bigger oil cooler and moving it to the front of the radiator i moved the sensors to be in line with the incoming oil to the oil cooler and i have noticed that it does get cooler now, this could be because it's getting more air (albeit still blocked by the heat exchanger) or it could be that the sensors are not getting heat soaked from the header or a combination. It may be worth noting that I also have removed the stock oil cooler and have jumpered the coolant lines to the oil cooler.
I completely agree that my temps (both oil and coolant) are abnormally hot. I have not encountered anyone who has as many cooling modifications as I do and still has trouble. They were hot with the first engine that i blew and they are still hot with the second. This is why I am re-evaluating my radiator and cooler orientation and will be wrapping the headers.
It's good to know im not the only one. I just had my AC evacuated and recharged at a shop with a vacuum as i was worried something was blocked. It is blowing cold but taxing the system.
The strange part for me is that I am running exactly what your old setup was (Mishimoto 19 row oil cooler in the bumper with ducting) and track the car in 90+ degree Texas weather and I never see oil temps over ~260 even after a 20 minute session. This is also with an aftermarket header (PLM) with no heat shield and the stock "oil warmer" still on the car.
The strange part for me is that I am running exactly what your old setup was (Mishimoto 19 row oil cooler in the bumper with ducting) and track the car in 90+ degree Texas weather and I never see oil temps over ~260 even after a 20 minute session. This is also with an aftermarket header (PLM) with no heat shield and the stock "oil warmer" still on the car.
Very interesting. Here are a few photos of my setup, feel free to comment. I think that the ducting combined with the louvers restricted too much airflow. The lovers would get really hot so I know it was doing something but it wasn't enough. I double checked the temp sensor with boiling water and it was accurate, but like i said it was mounted in an aluminum sandwich plate right below the header, so heat soak may have been an issue. If you dont mind my asking:
what gauges and temp sensors were you using?
where did you have them mounted?
Are you boosted? What kit? How many lbs?
What brand and oil weight were you using?
Was the cooler mounted on drivers or passengers side?
What did your ducting look like?
I am just trying to compare the setups as much as possible. I have seen others run far less cooling mods in the same conditions and have much lower temps. I feel there is something wrong with the setup but i am having trouble pinpointing what it is/was. Could it be the tune? If so, what specifically?
oil cooler on right side, supercharger cooler on left, new ac condenser, mr sideways rad, and opening the top part of the bumper gives more air flow to the rad. It can stay on track till the fuel runs low. Wont overheat. It also has oversized gurney flaps infront of the hood vents to allow for better extraction by having them above the boundary layer.
oil cooler on right side, supercharger cooler on left, new ac condenser, mr sideways rad, and opening the top part of the bumper gives more air flow to the rad. It can stay on track till the fuel runs low. Wont overheat. It also has oversized gurney flaps infront of the hood vents to allow for better extraction by having them above the boundary layer.
I like opening the top of the bumper, been thinking of doing that myself. Do you have a closeup that you can share? I would like to see exactly where to cut the bumper and how much of the air reaches the top of the radiator.
Nice work! Those cutouts above the main bumper opening is exactly what I'm talking about to get more clean airflow to the radiator.
With forced induction, I'm convinced the oil coolers need to be mounted in the corners if you want to be able to track the car.
My only suggestion for improvement of this setup is to build an airbox around the air filter so that you're not sucking up hot air coming off the radiator. Doesn't even have to be a full box, just enough to block the air coming off the radiator from reaching the air filter. Then run a duct from one of the upper cutout openings to grab cold air and direct it towards the filter. Heck, can probably find an OEM air snorkel off some car and make it work. I was even thinking a neoprene brake duct tube, but the metal winding used to keep that tube round would make it a pain in the ass to close your hood as you've have to crush it every time. I suppose if you just go ahead and crush the metal windings, it'll keep an oval shape.
