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Knock Count

 
Old 02-16-2019, 12:30 AM
  #21  
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Originally Posted by Mijae007 View Post
How do they look? Cyl4 looks a tad rich. Also it was just coldstarted and idled for 5mins or so.
Actually #4 looks ok/fine, slightly damp but not rich running or overly lean, likely just incomplete firing from cold start/when you pulled the plug, its the least of what should be focused on based on how the other 3 plugs look which do look lean, based on white crusty color and also show signs of detonation as you suspected - which is the "popcorn" looking white dots/balls on electrode. Id say unlikely its a injector specific issue based on multiple plugs showing signs. Its not severe detonation, but signs are there so id say safe to move to next step of figuring out why/where the fault lies. Your tuner should be able to figure this out if he is worth two shits.

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Old 02-16-2019, 06:28 AM
  #22  
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After tracing vac lines, can you generate a log and share? Whatever ECU you’re using, are you able to tell which cylinder is knocking in your software?

So it might actually be real knock, good thing we didn’t just pull the useless knock sensor. Ha.
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Old 02-16-2019, 10:14 AM
  #23  
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Originally Posted by EOE View Post
After tracing vac lines, can you generate a log and share? Whatever ECU you’re using, are you able to tell which cylinder is knocking in your software?

So it might actually be real knock, good thing we didn’t just pull the useless knock sensor. Ha.
yea its primarily cyl2. Then 3. Hardly any in 1 and none in 4. Ill have to take apart my vacuum block and make sure its clean inside.
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Old 02-16-2019, 10:33 AM
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Originally Posted by Mijae007 View Post
yea its primarily cyl2. Then 3. Hardly any in 1 and none in 4. Ill have to take apart my vacuum block and make sure its clean inside.
That would be consistent with my plug reading.

When was the last time you had a valve check/adjustment? Too tight of valves can cause some erratic running behavior and an increase in combustion temps which can lead to detonation in individual cylinders. Its something to keep in mind during your troubleshooting list. If you have individual cylinder tuning perimeters in your ecu, I would look there as well.

Last edited by s2000Junky; 02-16-2019 at 10:49 AM.
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Old 02-16-2019, 05:53 PM
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Originally Posted by hatrickstu View Post
Agreed


As someone who works for an internationally respected tuning shop that builds some of the craziest R35's on the planet, I am going to have to strongly disagree with this. Do you really think high end ECU manufacturers are integrating multiple knock frequency channels and individual cylinder knock control because it can't be accurately monitored electronically?

A relevant article on the matter here, again by a globally respected source...

https://www.hpacademy.com/technical-...ing-for-knock/

Reading the plugs after a pull does NOTHING to prevent potential damage occurring on the run itself. What happens if conditions change when compared to when he was tuning the car and it actually does knock? Just pull those plugs and hope she holds together? It's honestly pretty mind blowing that you are really suggesting just reading the plugs after a hard pull in 2019. Is your tuner faxing over new cal's too? Part of your tuner's job should be actually finding the knock frequency for your car so that the ECU can protect the engine before it's too late.
How exactly do you think knock was checked back in the day? It's not like we have been using knock sensors and advanced ecu's since the beginning and I wasn't talking about not using knock sensors that are accurate. I was talking about the junk knock sensor that is on the F2x engine. It is damn near impossible to get an accurate knock frequency with the stock knock sensor, so you may as well just shut it off until you get a better one and just read your plugs to confirm things. The issues with the stock knock sensor are the random phantom knock counts that happen that end up having the ECU pull timing when it isn't necessary.

My tuner doesn't tune on the ragged edge and we always pull the plugs to check for detonation signs after the final pull on the dyno. We don't rely on the stock knock sensor at this time to tell us if there is an issue. If I had a good accurate knock sensor on the car, then we will use it, along with checking the plugs.
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Old 02-16-2019, 09:59 PM
  #26  
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https://youtu.be/giqibS76Fz4

keeps fluctuating at idle going lean then making popping sounds then goes back to normal to do it all over again
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Old 02-16-2019, 10:03 PM
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Originally Posted by s2000Junky View Post
That would be consistent with my plug reading.

When was the last time you had a valve check/adjustment? Too tight of valves can cause some erratic running behavior and an increase in combustion temps which can lead to detonation in individual cylinders. Its something to keep in mind during your troubleshooting list. If you have individual cylinder tuning perimeters in your ecu, I would look there as well.
i got my valves readjusted last week. If anything its gotten worse. Im thinking its something mechanical. I just got my injectors cleaned today (altho initial flow test looked fine) and threw in new ngk 8 plugs gapped to the same .017 and no improvement.
the only thing left in the fuel system is the pump and regulator...
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Old 02-16-2019, 10:57 PM
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Dude maybe its just the flashpro. Its running totally fine now. No more leaning out. No more knocks. Im losing my mind over this. Im done. Just taking it back to me tuner and throwing it on the dyno. Donno why its running fine all of a sudden...
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Old 02-17-2019, 12:12 AM
  #29  
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Sorry my thread seems like im rambling all over the place. But my car is behaving as such. So once fully warmed up (not just coolant temp warmed up, but oil temps warmed up) it exhibits all those symptoms much less. When the oil is still cold, the afr's will fluctuate, record many knock counts (like 5-10 knock counts every time i pass 3000-4000rpm). I wonder if this is mechanical or software. Thing is i dont think there are parameters in flashpro to fix this problem via tuning. Now, with the cleaned injectors and new spark plugs it still picks up knock counts in 3000-4000rpm range but only in 1st and 2nd gear and now maybe only records 1 knock count every other run past that rpm range. I have a feeling this will progressively get worse again. I really want to get to the root of the problem. For whatever reason replacing the spark plugs reduced the symptoms. Once warmed up, AFRs are good too at cruising and idle. Ill check again tomorrow morning when its cold to see if the knocks and lean out are worse than they were tonight.
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Old 02-17-2019, 07:26 AM
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Just a guess, but could it possibly be due to something with your coolant temp sensor settings? Have the warm up enrichment table and things been set up properly?

Probably a long shot but what about the coils? If you have a lot of miles on them they could be getting weaker.

Last edited by Spoolin; 02-17-2019 at 07:33 AM.
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