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Also for everyone interested in this bracket I keep going on about:
Kraftwerks came up with this added attachment that bolts to the VTEC solenoid bracket they supply and adds an extra mounting point to the timing cover:
LHT's solution which they said they started doing after kit 25 was to weld a piece to the supplied solenoid bracket and using an existing mounting bolt in the head for a more robust solution. This leads me to believe they must have experienced some issues in testing customer cars or noted some deficiency in the design that they weren't happy with to continue installing on customer cars unaddressed. This is all pure speculation and in no way am I trying to bash LHT whatsoever. I applaud their innovation and respect their position as far as keeping their own little ideas and what not to themselves. John even said he can't give away all his secrets in the video and likened it to Coca Cola not giving out their formula. I respect his position and ultimately responsibility rests with Kraftwerks to make this kit reliable for public consumption; it's not LHT's responsibility to make it better, they just do so out of respect for their customers and their hard-earned money.
Kudos to LHT and all of their efforts to innovate and ensure customers get the most out of their expectations and money spent. I applaud them going above and beyond to take matters into their own hands as well as giving back to the community by sharing this information. I watch all of their videos religiously and usually can't wait to watch their daily uploads after work. There's just something so calming but also such a good feeling watching these guys meticulously go about their work in such a methodical but also attentive and respectful demeanor when dealing with a vehicle that isn't their own. It says a lot about a shop and their integrity and honestly I'm still considering going to them for a KW kit even if the cost is upped just out of knowing I'll be able to rely on the kit after they install it and two I WANT to give them my business, they've essentially won me over by how open they are to their customers, the community, and also the public in general.
So is KW supplying that extra bracket? I have a KW kit and wondering if I can have that sent by itself or if that is only available on new kits.
Replied to your PM; unfortunately I don’t know if KW offers this separately, but I couldn’t imagine them not. If I had a kit without it I’d love to know myself. Hit them up and see what they’ll do for you, and potentially any other owner without this update that would also like info on getting it.
Here’s a link to the video for anyone else who’s curious:
That one’s part number is C032-0148-07. So another change was definitely made. It looks like you’ll need the above solenoid bracket, whatever that bracing “stick” is that attaches to it (didn’t see a part number on it) and the Allen bolt that mates the two.
Yeah, I mean if the car didn't give me any problems and I was happy with how things operated in that time frame, then eating the cost wouldn't be as painful after such a period of time. But that was with the eventuality that it did happen, not expecting it to, but from all accounts the Paxton blowers have been nothing but good to most people and people stay happy with them. I just really like the jet-like sound of the Rotrex, and I think a lot of that stems from the cog drive of the KW kit along with the fact that its impeller spins twice as fast as your standard supercharger design because it uses a planetary design instead of gear reduction.
LHT I believe have figured out where the weaknesses are in the KW kits and essentially correct potential issues in the weak points before they arise; that reinforced bracket being the biggest thing for me. KW has sold a shitload of kits, and at this point to come out with an entirely new bracket design wouldn't look good for them, because that would be admitting to deficiencies that align with all of the problems people have been having, and as some have said it's easier to give great customer service and fix issues as they arise vs. spending the money on a revised design and upgrading all of your past customers. As a company and business I can understand that if it's truly the case....It's a tough spot for company and customer alike...I honestly like the kit, if it proved to be more reliable I'd buy it with confidence. I'm going to start going through the LHT videos and making notes of what they mention they do different in their installs and essentially making a chronicle of what it is. I don't think they're being purposefully secretive as they've slowly been revealing what they do different, and since it's just a few brackets etc you can only change so much about what's being done to install the kit.
Watch the latest flat black LHT civic video. All of a sudden traction fluid is determining how much boost it’s holding. I don’t like it. Also, the Video is suggesting that’s the owner didn’t change the fluid enough, but how do we know what’s true? Once again I’m pushed to SOS as my next SC. I say all this while I’ve communicated with LHT and I was willing to drive down from Boston to see them... which I might still do but for SOS kit, not Rotrex.
Watch the latest flat black LHT civic video. All of a sudden traction fluid is determining how much boost it’s holding. I don’t like it. Also, the Video is suggesting that’s the owner didn’t change the fluid enough, but how do we know what’s true? Once again I’m pushed to SOS as my next SC. I say all this while I’ve communicated with LHT and I was willing to drive down from Boston to see them... which I might still do but for SOS kit, not Rotrex.
I saw that! And honestly that’s kind of embarrassing; especially when George was saying earlier in the video that it hasn’t been in for maintenance because the kit is “so dang reliable”.
That really is BS for the blower to shit out like that, if that really was the case. Some comments talked about the BPV potentially being spotty, but yeah that’s weird...If the fluid wasn’t maintained though I don’t know if Rotrex can be faulted.
It seems like the Rotrex is just really finicky for daily use. Hitting the rev-limiter or 2-stepping can potentially void your warranty? Uh, what? Sometimes, especially on a track or on the street, hitting the limiter happens....A mechanical over-rev will also frag the blower which isn’t nearly as much of an issue with the Paxton.
I was so dead-set on the KW kit based on LHT videos, the sound, the power it makes, etc. But seeing the issues here with the kit specifically, as well as Rotrex units themselves having very spotty reliability across all platforms, I feel like I’m being pushed further and further away the more digging and compiling of info I do.
I personally don't understand why people get Superchargers when 90% of the time driving is under 5,000rpm.
Get a smaller Turbo - Garrett GTX3071R with an 0.82a/r and enjoy the driving experience two fold whilst under 5000rpm, enjoy the extra torque and the intoxicating noises too.
I personally don't understand why people get Superchargers when 90% of the time driving is under 5,000rpm.
Get a smaller Turbo - Garrett GTX3071R with an 0.82a/r and enjoy the driving experience two fold whilst under 5000rpm, enjoy the extra torque and the intoxicating noises too.
For the exact reason we bought the S2000 in the first place, because of the high revving engine character, its just more fun to be above 5k. Supercharging keeps with the integrity of the car, but just a lot more goodness, also making neat noises. There are plenty of other cars out there that make their power under 5k rpms. You know, like 99% of the cars on the road, right?
I saw that! And honestly that’s kind of embarrassing; especially when George was saying earlier in the video that it hasn’t been in for maintenance because the kit is “so dang reliable”.
That really is BS for the blower to shit out like that, if that really was the case. Some comments talked about the BPV potentially being spotty, but yeah that’s weird...If the fluid wasn’t maintained though I don’t know if Rotrex can be faulted.
It seems like the Rotrex is just really finicky for daily use. Hitting the rev-limiter or 2-stepping can potentially void your warranty? Uh, what? Sometimes, especially on a track or on the street, hitting the limiter happens....A mechanical over-rev will also frag the blower which isn’t nearly as much of an issue with the Paxton.
I was so dead-set on the KW kit based on LHT videos, the sound, the power it makes, etc. But seeing the issues here with the kit specifically, as well as Rotrex units themselves having very spotty reliability across all platforms, I feel like I’m being pushed further and further away the more digging and compiling of info I do.
You are smart doing your own exhaustive research and are leading yourself to the right conclusions based on what im hearing you say so far. As someone who has been in this boosted s2k game for a long time and around when the first C30 kw kit had its debut, I can tell you KW is a miserable company support wise, and has not changed in how they deal with thier customers, from using us as beta testers, to then having poor communication, to long waits when things go south and then after all that charging their customers the updated parts that were shown to fail in a widespread way rather then offering them at no charge.
The Current new C38/cogged belt system has proven to be no different, but now with its own inherent problems because of the cogged belt system, which im sure you are finding in all the failures and remedies this time around. However one thing that cant be remedied is the fact that the glass rotrex blower is now tied directing to engine rpm and trq because the belt can no longer give and slip like it can with the typical ribbed system. Anyone that has owned a supercharged s2k knows how almost unavoidable it is to bounce off the rev limiter when driving on top of the car in a spirited and fun way. Having a system design that does not favor this or risk to the blower is completely unacceptable.
Last edited by s2000Junky; 11-12-2018 at 07:21 PM.
You are smart doing your own exhaustive research and are leading yourself to the right conclusions based on what im hearing you say so far. As someone who has been in this boosted s2k game for a long time and around when the first C30 kw kit had its debut, I can tell you KW is a miserable company support wise, and has not changed in how they deal with thier customers, from using us as beta testers, to then having poor communication, to long waits when things go south and then after all that charging their customers the updated parts that were shown to fail in a widespread way rather then offering them at no charge.
The Current new C38/cogged belt system has proven to be no different, but now with its own inherent problems because of the cogged belt system, which im sure you are finding in all the failures and remedies this time around. However one thing that cant be remedied is the fact that the glass rotrex blower is now tied directing to engine rpm and trq because the belt can no longer give and slip like it can with the typical ribbed system. Anyone that has owned a supercharged s2k knows how almost unavoidable it is to bounce off the rev limiter when driving on top of the car in a spirited and fun way. Having a system design that does not favor this or risk to the blower is completely unacceptable.
Thank you for all of your input and support man (and the airbag, I still gotta blow the other one up). I appreciate you taking the time to chime in on my thread and guide me in the right direction or atleast comment on my findings and opinions. I was going to make mention of the cogged belt setup (I think you did earlier too?) transferring a lot more shock and essentially allowing for no give vs. a ribbed setup, but I'm far from an engineer or anything like that, but from a mechanical standpoint it makes sense. The Rotrex unit itself seems to be incredibly simple in design and has very few moving parts. I think if the internals used some beefier materials it might help increase the longevity/durability of the unit, but again, I'm no engineer, nor do I know if the internals in there are already made from tough stuff already.
One thing I did want to ask you, because I'm not seeing much info on it: Do you know if the HD bearing and straight-cut gears is available for the Paxton Novi 1200 specifically? I perused the internet today and really didn't find anything on this forum as far as someone sending out a 1200 to be upgraded. Online I saw that it's available for the 1500 and 2200 series, but no mention of the 1200. It seems there's a Vortech V3 Si "Heritage" model that has the straight gears in it, and seems to share the same platform as the Novi. Even though I'm nowhere near pulling the trigger on putting a supercharger on this car at this point in time of my build, I'd like to know. I suppose I'll just give them a call tomorrow to get a definitive answer. I saw it mentioned in the FAQ, but not much more info beyond that. I'd really like the added whistle and durability of the straight gears
And yeah, the more into KW I'm seeing more and more holes. I'll never stop supporting LHT, but I do think they have a small bias towards Skunk2/KW parts as they exclusively sell Alpha headers (never been impressed with the quality of these) and they have the banners and logos all over the place. Having that kind of relationship while also having put themselves in the position of being an "exclusive" installer of the kit for s2000s and other Hondas it seems like it would behoove them to tip toe around any issues they may have with their products, while also doing their own thing to ensure that the products will last for their customers. John mentioned in the video he fabbed that bracket about 25-30 kits ago "to address a similar problem or similar fix" almost like he was stopping himself from saying too much on camera.
I'm not trying to play detective here, but I'm starting to think that LHT has had a pretty big hand in communicating with kraftwerks various flaws etc, as they started using better hardware (ARP) in key areas, adding Loctite to the pre-assembled blower bracket, reinforcing brackets, and lo and behold this is all now coming standard in KW kits, albeit a different design on the bracket. I had originally intended for this thread to just go over some ideas for my own personal build, but I think it's also become a good spot to gather information on accrued data and knowledge from both forum members as well as outside sources to help people make the best choice for their needs. With all of the comments, and now videos of Rotrex blowers failing after not a long amount of time, and then others coming in and having nothing but good things to say about their Paxton-based kits even after 7-8+ years is really telling in what the best choice is for someone who wants a reliable daily setup they don't need to worry about. Thank you to everyone for chiming in on this thread and tossing ideas around. I'll try to keep compiling information as well as follow-ups with my own progress as I get closer and closer to executing my build. I'll see what I can find throughout the KW videos by LHT as far as what they do differently and compile a list.
For the exact reason we bought the S2000 in the first place, because of the high revving engine character, its just more fun to be above 5k. Supercharging keeps with the integrity of the car, but just a lot more goodness, also making neat noises. There are plenty of other cars out there that make their power under 5k rpms. You know, like 99% of the cars on the road, right?
This is a prime example of hitting the nail on the head
11-12-2018, 01:06 AM
