B Street Advice/Prep
Joined: Feb 2013
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Originally Posted by DavidNJ' timestamp='1437583628' post='23689187
[quote name='viccath5' timestamp='1437577746' post='23689017']
sorry for the misinformation, I have the 1.25" hollow bar with .25" wall thickness.
sorry for the misinformation, I have the 1.25" hollow bar with .25" wall thickness.
A track car or a car at a multi-day event could conceivably change front and rear bars in addition to adjusting lever arm length. If they were done with out preload they wouldn't affect cross weight.
Generally though with current autocross formats where all the runs occur with maybe 10 min-20 min spacing those sorts of changes aren't practical. Has anyone made level arm length adjustments between runs?
[/quote]
And that type r character is a crazy one for changing the gendron between runs, if you ask me. I wouldn't recommend it. I suppose if you've done the exact adjustment before. But depending on the hole change, sometimes I have to take the end bar off. Not ideal for between runs.
Joined: Jun 2010
Posts: 1,881
Likes: 6
From: Near Philadelphia
Originally Posted by IntegraR0064' timestamp='1437586524' post='23689248
[quote name='DavidNJ' timestamp='1437583628' post='23689187']
[quote name='viccath5' timestamp='1437577746' post='23689017']
sorry for the misinformation, I have the 1.25" hollow bar with .25" wall thickness.
[quote name='viccath5' timestamp='1437577746' post='23689017']
sorry for the misinformation, I have the 1.25" hollow bar with .25" wall thickness.
A track car or a car at a multi-day event could conceivably change front and rear bars in addition to adjusting lever arm length. If they were done with out preload they wouldn't affect cross weight.
Generally though with current autocross formats where all the runs occur with maybe 10 min-20 min spacing those sorts of changes aren't practical. Has anyone made level arm length adjustments between runs?
[/quote]
And that type r character is a crazy one for changing the gendron between runs, if you ask me. I wouldn't recommend it. I suppose if you've done the exact adjustment before. But depending on the hole change, sometimes I have to take the end bar off. Not ideal for between runs.
[/quote]
agreed, wouldn't recommend it, it's a stressful experience. And your preload will be off.
Joined: Apr 2006
Posts: 1,953
Likes: 51
Originally Posted by DavidNJ' timestamp='1437583628' post='23689187
[quote name='viccath5' timestamp='1437577746' post='23689017']
sorry for the misinformation, I have the 1.25" hollow bar with .25" wall thickness.
sorry for the misinformation, I have the 1.25" hollow bar with .25" wall thickness.
A track car or a car at a multi-day event could conceivably change front and rear bars in addition to adjusting lever arm length. If they were done with out preload they wouldn't affect cross weight.
Generally though with current autocross formats where all the runs occur with maybe 10 min-20 min spacing those sorts of changes aren't practical. Has anyone made level arm length adjustments between runs?
[/quote]
Umm...he welds his end plates to the bar...so they wouldn't be changeable. I stand corrected. I wonder if he started as a spinded bar and he either cut-off and/or welded over the spine.
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Joined: Sep 2010
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Originally Posted by mball19' timestamp='1437503257' post='23688020
I have a 2006 that I have been autocrossing for about a year in BS and I have been using the following set up.
Eibach FSB set to full stiff. So far this bar is plenty stiff for the surface I run on (asphalt only). I have seen a few pictures of my car almost lifting the inside front tire around corners. I can't imagine using a stiffer bar and have had no issues with lifting the inside rear tire.
225/255 Hankook RS3s V2. I think that I would prefer 245s in the front as my car typically has neutral to understeer behavior. It is almost impossible to rotate the rear under throttle with 255s in the rear. I am running 37psi front and 35 psi rear.
I am running max camber up front (~ -1.8) with zero toe and max caster. My rear camber is matched to the front and I am running a little toe in rear.
I still have stock shocks, exhaust and brakes.
Eibach FSB set to full stiff. So far this bar is plenty stiff for the surface I run on (asphalt only). I have seen a few pictures of my car almost lifting the inside front tire around corners. I can't imagine using a stiffer bar and have had no issues with lifting the inside rear tire.
225/255 Hankook RS3s V2. I think that I would prefer 245s in the front as my car typically has neutral to understeer behavior. It is almost impossible to rotate the rear under throttle with 255s in the rear. I am running 37psi front and 35 psi rear.
I am running max camber up front (~ -1.8) with zero toe and max caster. My rear camber is matched to the front and I am running a little toe in rear.
I still have stock shocks, exhaust and brakes.
I cant imagine you lifting a tire with that bar, or even the stiffest Gendron most likely. I dont know any serious autocrossers that run anything less stiff than a Moddiction\Saner bar for very long. I have also never seen one lift a front tire in a BS setup even with the Gendron on full stiff. Maybe others have, but not I.
You mention you are lifting an inside REAR tire? I have never seen that on an S2000. Are you sure you didnt mean front? If lifting the inside rear, your diff is then open and I can imagine the car behaves horribly. And if you are lifting or near lifting the inside rear, you are nowhere close to lifting the inside front. You dont have enough grip to be lifting both inside wheels at once, so any lift would be mostly due to weight transfer and bar setups, which will typically lift one or the other, but not both.
I read somewhere on here about people lifting the inside rear tire in corners. That may have only applied to cars with slicks.
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Joined: May 2014
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That is a long ways from lifting the front tire. It is light, but still not lifting. I have pictures of my Scion tC with the front looking like that, and I can tell you that short of hitting a curb on a racetrack at high speed you will NOT lift the front tire on that car in a corner 
Joined: Oct 2011
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As a data point, an AS CR with the Monster Gendron/SFR bar on 3/6 and Bridgestone RE-71R 255 square can lighten the inside rear enough on tighter corners that the Torsen unlocks on corner exit. I don't know if it actually got off the ground though.
Joined: Apr 2006
Posts: 1,953
Likes: 51
Originally Posted by engifineer' timestamp='1437508087' post='23688147
[quote name='mball19' timestamp='1437503257' post='23688020']
I have a 2006 that I have been autocrossing for about a year in BS and I have been using the following set up.
Eibach FSB set to full stiff. So far this bar is plenty stiff for the surface I run on (asphalt only). I have seen a few pictures of my car almost lifting the inside front tire around corners. I can't imagine using a stiffer bar and have had no issues with lifting the inside rear tire.
225/255 Hankook RS3s V2. I think that I would prefer 245s in the front as my car typically has neutral to understeer behavior. It is almost impossible to rotate the rear under throttle with 255s in the rear. I am running 37psi front and 35 psi rear.
I am running max camber up front (~ -1.8) with zero toe and max caster. My rear camber is matched to the front and I am running a little toe in rear.
I still have stock shocks, exhaust and brakes.
I have a 2006 that I have been autocrossing for about a year in BS and I have been using the following set up.
Eibach FSB set to full stiff. So far this bar is plenty stiff for the surface I run on (asphalt only). I have seen a few pictures of my car almost lifting the inside front tire around corners. I can't imagine using a stiffer bar and have had no issues with lifting the inside rear tire.
225/255 Hankook RS3s V2. I think that I would prefer 245s in the front as my car typically has neutral to understeer behavior. It is almost impossible to rotate the rear under throttle with 255s in the rear. I am running 37psi front and 35 psi rear.
I am running max camber up front (~ -1.8) with zero toe and max caster. My rear camber is matched to the front and I am running a little toe in rear.
I still have stock shocks, exhaust and brakes.
I cant imagine you lifting a tire with that bar, or even the stiffest Gendron most likely. I dont know any serious autocrossers that run anything less stiff than a Moddiction\Saner bar for very long. I have also never seen one lift a front tire in a BS setup even with the Gendron on full stiff. Maybe others have, but not I.
You mention you are lifting an inside REAR tire? I have never seen that on an S2000. Are you sure you didnt mean front? If lifting the inside rear, your diff is then open and I can imagine the car behaves horribly. And if you are lifting or near lifting the inside rear, you are nowhere close to lifting the inside front. You dont have enough grip to be lifting both inside wheels at once, so any lift would be mostly due to weight transfer and bar setups, which will typically lift one or the other, but not both.
I read somewhere on here about people lifting the inside rear tire in corners. That may have only applied to cars with slicks.
[/quote]
That looks very well balanced.,.what is the setup?
That is a long ways from lifting the front tire. It is light, but still not lifting. I have pictures of my Scion tC with the front looking like that, and I can tell you that short of hitting a curb on a racetrack at high speed you will NOT lift the front tire on that car in a corner
Joined: Jun 2010
Posts: 1,881
Likes: 6
From: Near Philadelphia
STR has been street tires from the beginning, but yes it's common to lift one tire and have the other be just touching on the inside edge, especially in a case like I had for a while where my shocks didn't have that much droop. BS is probably not far behind.
Joined: Apr 2006
Posts: 1,953
Likes: 51
Originally Posted by DavidNJ' timestamp='1437699334' post='23690960
I think we are approaching lateral acceleration levels that could lift inside wheels. I think I've seem pictures of very stiff, lowered, STRs lifting both inside tires (air under both), but that may have been in the Hoosier era.