ha! those four wheels are made of magnesium and tire compound as soft as butta, not like street tires at all, the "gas" is highly modified. not like whats at your local BP. get my point? nothing alike at all.

rob, not sure if your being sarcastic or not but if you haven't watched that race id say check it out. its pretty cool to be able to see the two extremes next to each other one being later on the brakes but having the same lap times.

 

Yes, I was being sarcastic because I have lived that race many times. The braking ability of the S2000 is very hard to beat but this has nothing to do with the original post.

 

I vomit a little every time I had to hear that guy call a motorcycle race. He and Greg white are both terrible. Thank god for racingfor.me. Now I can get the native streams with the Brit commentators.

Slightly off topic rob but I sell some validity in them playing up the concertina effect.

In motogp a few years ago Honda gp bikes were the acceleration monsters while the yamahas had to carry speed in the corners. To make things easier, both would run similar race simulation times. But because the Honda would sit in front during the race and basically run a defensive line and deny the Yamaha it's ability to use it's higher cornering speed. Actually that's misleading, the Yamaha would take an arc, using more lean angle for a longer period of time, while the Honda would take a v line, similar maximum corner speed.

The Yamaha would kills it's brakes and tires trying to overtake the Honda which was just using it's better acceleration/top speed characteristic. Basically, the Honda factory riders were able to force the Yamaha into attrition.


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The sound is definatley different that's for sure. But, I've been into F1 since the 1970's. So, I've listened to V's and flats and boxer, I've listened to 4,6,8,10 and 12 cylinders, and NA and turbos, and generally speaking, you get used to what you listen to. The high pitched wail of the F1 cars of the last 12 years was really cool, but nothing like it ever was in the past. Because nothing in the past ever revved to 20,000rpm.

Yes, I agree with Rob's explanation in his original post, but every pro and good amateur racer knows this. Hobbs knows this. He's either just seeing small subtle things or just talking. But, he knows this. What matters is the time distance between two cars. It's like when I was a kid the told new drivers to have have at least 2 cars lengths between the car in front of you. Then, they got a little smarter and said, one car length for every 10mph you are driving. Then, they wised up and said 2 seconds between the car in front of you. Now, it's 3 seconds they recommend.


Racingfor.me is great. The BBC and Sky TV productions of F1 are like a stock Miata is to a Ferrari Challenge car. It is literally that much better. It's really heaven sent.

 

I think the whole thing in my opinion can be summed up in the driver. The biggest variable in racing. Even if you give two drivers the same car it would depend on then to use it how they would.

Closing in on a corner I've always found is a spirit thing. It's totally mental. I've known guys on the track that will brake later even if they jeopardise the ability of the brakes for the test of the lap. All to do with the mentality that they want to chase whatever is in front no matter what it is.

 

^That would mean the braking package is not sufficient and you have not been driving 10/10ths during the rest of your lap.

 

Seems like some confused people in here on BMW. They do not have a F1 team in 2014, end of story. And Sauber hasnt been owned by BMW since 2009 and dropped the logo in 2011. Some talks about getting back in when Honda does, but i doubt it.

This years F1 has been pretty exciting I think. Cant wait to not have my ears bleed from grandstands this year with hearing protection. I laugh at all the online people talking about sound when I doubt they've actually heard the new sound of F1. Even Berny took it back a little when he went to his first race.

 

I'll say this. Most are braking early when driving an S2k so the illusion of "late braking" is faster is very subjective. On the other hand, you can truly late brake an S2k into a corner BUT to avoid over slowing you have to roll off the brakes asap to not over slow while approaching mid corner. Also depends of what sectorof track is coming up next. Also, racing for position vs time is quite different on how to should brake.
I didn't read all the posts so sorry if anything I said is redundant.

Another thing to think about is how much spring rate you r running with. Higher spring rates will enable better weight transfer, therefore giving a driver the advantage of not having to "wait" on the car.

 

DTP. We will be opening cans of worms I think.

How to / should brake, doing that correctly would lead you to a better time. Timed. Racing with a car in front would be different with the personality of the driver.

 

In the op I said "BMW power" because it has been a few years since Hobbs mentioned the "powering away from the competition" thing. I know Mercedes is currently THE dominant engine in F1. I also realize there are differences between drivers and some guys actually do out brake others. I wasn't talking about them. I was talking about the classic, "I almost had you in the corner," guy or the fruitcake that thinks he's out braking you because he 'closes the gap' when braking from 130+ down to 45 mph for Turn 1.

For braking technique probably 90% of the readers of this forum don't trail brake enough--the s2k will turn-in with a shit-ton of brake pedal and there's lots of time to be made by REALLY threshold braking and REALLY releasing just enough brake to get the car to turn-in. Most discover this by accidentally braking what they think is too late and while in full ABS panic mode they turn the wheel at turn-in and the car turns in nicely to their surprise. Or if your car is wired for it you see your brake pedal pressure and g graph and realize how much more braking is possible (it helps if you can compare your data to a fast guy--always let the fast guy drive your car ).

You can practice this and learn what the car can do in a large empty parking lot. Get up to speed and get the car into full ABS braking and see how well the car turns (don't do this too many times or you'll melt your stock brake pads and the brakes can fail). This exercise can help even if you've been tracking the car for years. True threshold braking and heavy trail braking was one of the last skills I learned and led to big laptime gains.