Jacking car from side
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From: Copley, Ohio
Originally Posted by krazik,Nov 1 2006, 08:29 PM
again, been doing it forever. The only way to wreck a rocker panel is if you didn't make sure the jack was centered on the "lip" and it slipped off.
Early morning car prep is always risky !
Be careful
John
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From: Santa Cruz, CA, US
Originally Posted by davepk,Nov 2 2006, 06:19 PM
Its certainly more convenient that way but if you are thinking it will be stronger with the H&R setup, then you are mistaken.
Think Kansas city Hyatt(?) suspended walkway collapse.
Think Kansas city Hyatt(?) suspended walkway collapse.
Off to google it.
Why isn't the 2pc the way to go? You ideally would rarely remove the spacers.
-Ry
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From: Santa Cruz, CA, US
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From: Santa Cruz, CA
When you look into the mechanics of why it failed you'll find that they are the same thing...
Having said that... The H&R setup maybe sufficient on the track, i have no experience that says otherwise.
Having said that... The H&R setup maybe sufficient on the track, i have no experience that says otherwise.
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From: Santa Cruz, CA, US
Originally Posted by davepk,Nov 2 2006, 08:33 PM
When you look into the mechanics of why it failed you'll find that they are the same thing...
Having said that... The H&R setup maybe sufficient on the track, i have no experience that says otherwise.
Having said that... The H&R setup maybe sufficient on the track, i have no experience that says otherwise.
I'm not sure either way but it just seemed to that bolting the spacer to the wheel would be stronger than using long studs.
*shrug*
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From: Chicago
Actually, although I like your reference Dave and the presence of mind to think through the engineering problem, in this case that mode of failure doesn't apply. The KC catwalk failure was due to placing all the loads of the multiple floors onto one single set of nuts/washers on the top floor, rather than each nut/washer combo carrying it's own floor's weight. The bolts all along, as in this case, were designed to support the weight of all floors simultaneously.
That being said, I don't have the same "gut feel" as Rylan does and would tend towards using the spacers as spacers only, and not as an attachment point.
That being said, I don't have the same "gut feel" as Rylan does and would tend towards using the spacers as spacers only, and not as an attachment point.
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From: Covington WA, USA
Dave is in the right track here, but it's not quite the same.
The basic thing the studs do is create a tension that sucks the wheel onto the hub. That tension creates the friction force that transmits the torques.
In this case the wheel is bolted to the spacer and the spacer is bolted to the hub. Unlike in KC the spacer/hub connection is not carrying much of the load of itself plus the wheel.
But this does load the space itself in a different way than if you just used the spacer as a spacer and had long lugs. Just consider what would happen if the spacer cracked. In the long lug case, nothing much would happen. In this case, your wheel might fall off.
The basic thing the studs do is create a tension that sucks the wheel onto the hub. That tension creates the friction force that transmits the torques.
In this case the wheel is bolted to the spacer and the spacer is bolted to the hub. Unlike in KC the spacer/hub connection is not carrying much of the load of itself plus the wheel.
But this does load the space itself in a different way than if you just used the spacer as a spacer and had long lugs. Just consider what would happen if the spacer cracked. In the long lug case, nothing much would happen. In this case, your wheel might fall off.
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Originally Posted by mikegarrison,Nov 3 2006, 11:03 AM
Dave is in the right track here, but it's not quite the same.
The basic thing the studs do is create a tension that sucks the wheel onto the hub. That tension creates the friction force that transmits the torques.
In this case the wheel is bolted to the spacer and the spacer is bolted to the hub. Unlike in KC the spacer/hub connection is not carrying much of the load of itself plus the wheel.
But this does load the space itself in a different way than if you just used the spacer as a spacer and had long lugs. Just consider what would happen if the spacer cracked. In the long lug case, nothing much would happen. In this case, your wheel might fall off.
The basic thing the studs do is create a tension that sucks the wheel onto the hub. That tension creates the friction force that transmits the torques.
In this case the wheel is bolted to the spacer and the spacer is bolted to the hub. Unlike in KC the spacer/hub connection is not carrying much of the load of itself plus the wheel.
But this does load the space itself in a different way than if you just used the spacer as a spacer and had long lugs. Just consider what would happen if the spacer cracked. In the long lug case, nothing much would happen. In this case, your wheel might fall off.
However, an extended stud / spacer combo can turn horrible if the lug nuts become loose. The bending load on your wheel studs becomes dangerous in that situation.
I would imagine the lugs would continue to loosen at a faster rate with the spacer compared to without as well.
I think the scenario of a lug nut loosening during hot lapping is more probable than a cracked spacer anyhow.