S2000 Racing and Competition The S2000 on the track and Solo circuit. Some of the fastest S2000 drivers in the world call this forum home.

Need a left front lower control arm...

Thread Tools
 
Old Jul 3, 2012 | 10:53 PM
  #51  
Dipstick's Avatar
Thread Starter
25 Year Member
Photogenic
 
Joined: Dec 2000
Posts: 627
Likes: 0
From: Irvine
Default

Originally Posted by spdracerut
Originally Posted by Dipstick' timestamp='1341304814' post='21830152

Makes we want a full cage now...

@ Sam...I may take you up on that, let you know in a day or two...
That's exactly why the guys competing in S2k Challenge scare me. Watching their on-boards, they are pushing very hard and often over the limit as evidenced by how many times they go off-track during an event. I remember reading one guy went off 4 times in one day (I think Chuckwalla event this year); I've gone off 4 times in 10 years and they were all low-speed with tons of runoff area, so places I knew the consequences wouldn't be bad if I goofed.

I think it was a year or two ago that an older gentleman went off at Big Willow in a Mini Cooper, I think during a NASA event, and passed away.

All it takes is for a tire to go flat (puncture, debead, etc) or hit something slick (car spraying oil, coolant, dirt/sand kicked on track) in a fast sweeper and you're toast.
FYI, I run a hard dog bar, hans, and 6pt harness. I still drive this car on the street (using the OEM reel/harness) so this is pretty much all the safety gear you can do short of a full cage - hence my comment about the Flying 'Stang video.
Reply
Old Jul 4, 2012 | 02:59 PM
  #52  
spdracerut's Avatar
15 Year Member
Photogenic
Liked
 
Joined: Jun 2008
Posts: 1,593
Likes: 75
Default

Originally Posted by psychoazn
By this logic, you should be tracking nothing except a fully caged car with halo seats and the appropriate restraints. The common "rollbar harness seat" only protects you from rollovers, not lateral impacts and the lateral impacts that can happen as a result of rolling sideways...
Like I said, we all take calculated risks. I just went for a bicycle ride this morning and did 40mph down a hill in spandex and bicycle helmet. I also ride motorcycles on track and in the canyons and dial in my speed appropriately. There are plenty of guys going faster than me in the canyons and dragging knee around blind curves. I'm not willing to push that hard.

In a street car on a road course, I'm not willing to push as hard as a lot of other guys for a number of reasons including safety (others being wear/tear). I prefer to leave a larger safety margin to allow for the unexpected. So you say you've dropped two off; is that safe? Most of the time, it's probably fine and not a big deal (though more wear and tear). What happens if there's a big rut? Or if you slide sideways off into the dirt/grass/etc. Probably 49 out of 50 times, it'll be fine. What about that one time there's a rut that'll catch your wheel and roll the car?

I've been watching racing since I was 5 and seen all sorts of accidents. Sometimes, things that look like they will be fine end up in a bad way due to the unexpected. Heck, at my last motorcycle track day at Buttonwillow, one of the control riders (very experienced guys) had something happen in Talladega/Riverside/whatever it's called; totaled bike (Ducati), broken femur among other many broken bones and maybe a punctured lung. And this was a guy with years and years of track experience on a bike.

Like I said, we all take calculated risks. Some more risks than others. In my case, I'm just out having fun. I'm not getting paid to do it, I have nothing to prove. So for me, I'll dial it down a notch.
Reply
Old Jul 4, 2012 | 05:39 PM
  #53  
CKit's Avatar
Former Moderator
 
Joined: Aug 2004
Posts: 14,729
Likes: 8
Default

I wuss out and stay with Regional Club racing (SCCA). Less on the line and people tend to give each other a little more space rather than "rubbing is racing." I feel a little weird getting out on track in anything but a halo seat, HANS and full fire gear.
Reply
Old Jul 5, 2012 | 07:59 AM
  #54  
spdracerut's Avatar
15 Year Member
Photogenic
Liked
 
Joined: Jun 2008
Posts: 1,593
Likes: 75
Default

Originally Posted by CKit
I feel a little weird getting out on track in anything but a halo seat, HANS and full fire gear.
Funny you say that. On the motorcycle, I feel weird in anyless less than my boots, jacket, gloves, and helmet for riding around town on surface streets. Going on the highway and in the canyons, I'm fully geared with the back protector and pants too, just like at the track (though I don't push anywhere near that hard on public roads due to dirt/sand/oil/rocks/cars/cyclists/etc) Back in the day, I use to ride to school in shorts, t-shirt, sneakers with just a helmet and gloves (the short ones even, not the full gauntlet style to help protect the wrists); this was back in Florida and it was freakin hot and humid and I never went more than 50mph (city surface streets). On the bicycle doing 40mph.... I just don't look down; I would lose a lot of skin and meat crashing at that speed.

Anyway, everything is a cost:benefit ratio. The benefit being how much fun I'm having. The cost is what happens when things go wrong. In the case of the car, if you're lucky, it could be no damage to the alignment getting knocked out a bit. Worst, the car is totaled and the driver is in the hospital or dead. Looking at professional drivers, their 'benefit' is their salary, driving some of the most exclusive/badass machinary and also glory in winning in a professional race, so the much greater benefit makes the high cost (potential death) a better ratio. Note that they also have safety items in place to minimize likelyhood of the potential cost.

I've conducted my own cost:benefit ratio analysis. I did a two-day motorcycle trackday weekend over which there were 14 crashes sending half of those guys to the hospital (not to mention the wrecked bikes). I therefore backed it off (still having fun), made it home in one piece without any life-long altering injuries, and no damange to my pocketbook. About 4 years ago, I did four laps of the Nurburgring. I lost count of how many cars and bikes wrecked, but I saw a totaled brand new Civic SI and a totaled 911 GT3; I don't know about you guys, but I sure as hell can't afford to write those off. Probably the worst story I have is related to motorcycle riding. When I first moved out here, I went for a ride with some guys that had been riding for a while and they were hauling ass in the canyons. On the ride home, we were splitting lanes which I do cautiously and they were flying between cars. I let them go and went home at my own pace. Two weeks later, I found out one of the guys was in a very bad wreck in the canyons and was in critical condition. He had two little girls. Was the benefit worth the cost?

So, in my opinion, I think everyone needs to conduct their own cost:benefit analysis and then determine their driving behaviors. Sorry if I come off as a bit preachy, but after having done track days for over a decade, I don't think many people really think of the potential costs. Hell, I did a lot of stupid shit when I was a teenager and in college because I didn't think and I managed to make it out alive; But I look back and consider myself lucky as I could easily be dead.
Reply
Old Jul 17, 2012 | 09:04 PM
  #55  
Dipstick's Avatar
Thread Starter
25 Year Member
Photogenic
 
Joined: Dec 2000
Posts: 627
Likes: 0
From: Irvine
Default

Originally Posted by spdracerut
Originally Posted by CKit' timestamp='1341452341' post='21834599
I feel a little weird getting out on track in anything but a halo seat, HANS and full fire gear.
Funny you say that. On the motorcycle, I feel weird in anyless less than my boots, jacket, gloves, and helmet for riding around town on surface streets. Going on the highway and in the canyons, I'm fully geared with the back protector and pants too, just like at the track (though I don't push anywhere near that hard on public roads due to dirt/sand/oil/rocks/cars/cyclists/etc) Back in the day, I use to ride to school in shorts, t-shirt, sneakers with just a helmet and gloves (the short ones even, not the full gauntlet style to help protect the wrists); this was back in Florida and it was freakin hot and humid and I never went more than 50mph (city surface streets). On the bicycle doing 40mph.... I just don't look down; I would lose a lot of skin and meat crashing at that speed.

Anyway, everything is a cost:benefit ratio. The benefit being how much fun I'm having. The cost is what happens when things go wrong. In the case of the car, if you're lucky, it could be no damage to the alignment getting knocked out a bit. Worst, the car is totaled and the driver is in the hospital or dead. Looking at professional drivers, their 'benefit' is their salary, driving some of the most exclusive/badass machinary and also glory in winning in a professional race, so the much greater benefit makes the high cost (potential death) a better ratio. Note that they also have safety items in place to minimize likelyhood of the potential cost.

I've conducted my own cost:benefit ratio analysis. I did a two-day motorcycle trackday weekend over which there were 14 crashes sending half of those guys to the hospital (not to mention the wrecked bikes). I therefore backed it off (still having fun), made it home in one piece without any life-long altering injuries, and no damange to my pocketbook. About 4 years ago, I did four laps of the Nurburgring. I lost count of how many cars and bikes wrecked, but I saw a totaled brand new Civic SI and a totaled 911 GT3; I don't know about you guys, but I sure as hell can't afford to write those off. Probably the worst story I have is related to motorcycle riding. When I first moved out here, I went for a ride with some guys that had been riding for a while and they were hauling ass in the canyons. On the ride home, we were splitting lanes which I do cautiously and they were flying between cars. I let them go and went home at my own pace. Two weeks later, I found out one of the guys was in a very bad wreck in the canyons and was in critical condition. He had two little girls. Was the benefit worth the cost?

So, in my opinion, I think everyone needs to conduct their own cost:benefit analysis and then determine their driving behaviors. Sorry if I come off as a bit preachy, but after having done track days for over a decade, I don't think many people really think of the potential costs. Hell, I did a lot of stupid shit when I was a teenager and in college because I didn't think and I managed to make it out alive; But I look back and consider myself lucky as I could easily be dead.
Amen, brother!

If anyone cares, new arms are on the car and West End was able to get my alignment (seems like no other frame damage).
Had the car at SOWS and SMMR since, feels tight!
Reply
Old Jul 17, 2012 | 09:09 PM
  #56  
krazik's Avatar
Administrator
25 Year Member
Liked
Loved
 
Joined: Oct 2000
Posts: 17,004
Likes: 7
From: Santa Cruz, CA, US
Default

sweet! yeah I was certain no frame damage. glad it's back!
Reply
Related Topics
Thread
Thread Starter
Forum
Replies
Last Post
2kmunpo
Nevada S2000 Owners
2
Mar 1, 2008 01:30 PM
s2ktarga
S2000 Meets and Events
2
Mar 17, 2006 02:25 PM
Tedster
S2000 Meets and Events
0
Jul 2, 2001 01:53 PM
malachi
S2000 Meets and Events
0
Mar 13, 2001 09:08 PM




All times are GMT -8. The time now is 12:20 AM.