Race Prep/Streetability Direction Needed
01-24-2019, 08:27 AM
#21
Ive done 50-60 track weekends in 10 years and i instruct and race TT5. What you cant possibly understand if youre a novice is how complex a mental and physical task it is to go fast. As a novice if you are going so aggressive that safety gear is needed your doing it wrong. You have to work into speed slow and steady. You shouldnt spin out at all. Saftey gear is never a bad thing though because oil dumps from broken cars is always possible but dont do saftey gear because you think you will put yourself in danger. You are in control of car prep and your on track judgment. For safety mods to work better than OEM stock you have to spend the money and cut the car with no shortcuts.
Show up to your first event with 300ish treadwear tires, a tire pressure gage, lug wrench, and non agressive but track intended brake pads. Install new brake lines and flush with the highest temp brake fluid at your local auto parts store. You dont need racing brake fluid at first. Stock safety is fine. Open face helmets are better with the air bag still in use but wear eye protection.
The worst things a novice can do. 1. Think you know better than the instructor. 2. Buy tires with too much grip. 3. Not have studied the group rules and procedures.
To drive a car well you have to hold the car at the limit of traction in every corner every lap. With very sticky tires you have to go very fast to find the limit. Faster than your brain will calculate whats going on and respond to your eyes hands and feet with driver corrections. Your grip level needs to be proportional to your brain processing speed. Processing speed increases as you gradually expose yourself to the limit of traction. So you can more often and with less danger exercise your brain and coordination with hard tires. Once you master 300 Tredwear try 200 TW. Dont go to RComps untill you are comfortable sideways in most if not all corners. Making your car faster will increase the time it will take to become a competent driver.
If you dont study the rules your instructor will have to teach them too you instead of teaching you how to drive well.
Show up to your first event with 300ish treadwear tires, a tire pressure gage, lug wrench, and non agressive but track intended brake pads. Install new brake lines and flush with the highest temp brake fluid at your local auto parts store. You dont need racing brake fluid at first. Stock safety is fine. Open face helmets are better with the air bag still in use but wear eye protection.
The worst things a novice can do. 1. Think you know better than the instructor. 2. Buy tires with too much grip. 3. Not have studied the group rules and procedures.
To drive a car well you have to hold the car at the limit of traction in every corner every lap. With very sticky tires you have to go very fast to find the limit. Faster than your brain will calculate whats going on and respond to your eyes hands and feet with driver corrections. Your grip level needs to be proportional to your brain processing speed. Processing speed increases as you gradually expose yourself to the limit of traction. So you can more often and with less danger exercise your brain and coordination with hard tires. Once you master 300 Tredwear try 200 TW. Dont go to RComps untill you are comfortable sideways in most if not all corners. Making your car faster will increase the time it will take to become a competent driver.
If you dont study the rules your instructor will have to teach them too you instead of teaching you how to drive well.
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01-24-2019, 08:49 AM
#22
Registered User
Thread Starter
Ive done 50-60 track weekends in 10 years and i instruct and race TT5. What you cant possibly understand if youre a novice is how complex a mental and physical task it is to go fast. As a novice if you are going so aggressive that safety gear is needed your doing it wrong. You have to work into speed slow and steady. You shouldnt spin out at all. Saftey gear is never a bad thing though because oil dumps from broken cars is always possible but dont do saftey gear because you think you will put yourself in danger. You are in control of car prep and your on track judgment. For safety mods to work better than OEM stock you have to spend the money and cut the car with no shortcuts.
Show up to your first event with 300ish treadwear tires, a tire pressure gage, lug wrench, and non agressive but track intended brake pads. Install new brake lines and flush with the highest temp brake fluid at your local auto parts store. You dont need racing brake fluid at first. Stock safety is fine. Open face helmets are better with the air bag still in use but wear eye protection.
The worst things a novice can do. 1. Think you know better than the instructor. 2. Buy tires with too much grip. 3. Not have studied the group rules and procedures.
To drive a car well you have to hold the car at the limit of traction in every corner every lap. With very sticky tires you have to go very fast to find the limit. Faster than your brain will calculate whats going on and respond to your eyes hands and feet with driver corrections. Your grip level needs to be proportional to your brain processing speed. Processing speed increases as you gradually expose yourself to the limit of traction. So you can more often and with less danger exercise your brain and coordination with hard tires. Once you master 300 Tredwear try 200 TW. Dont go to RComps untill you are comfortable sideways in most if not all corners. Making your car faster will increase the time it will take to become a competent driver.
If you dont study the rules your instructor will have to teach them too you instead of teaching you how to drive well.
Show up to your first event with 300ish treadwear tires, a tire pressure gage, lug wrench, and non agressive but track intended brake pads. Install new brake lines and flush with the highest temp brake fluid at your local auto parts store. You dont need racing brake fluid at first. Stock safety is fine. Open face helmets are better with the air bag still in use but wear eye protection.
The worst things a novice can do. 1. Think you know better than the instructor. 2. Buy tires with too much grip. 3. Not have studied the group rules and procedures.
To drive a car well you have to hold the car at the limit of traction in every corner every lap. With very sticky tires you have to go very fast to find the limit. Faster than your brain will calculate whats going on and respond to your eyes hands and feet with driver corrections. Your grip level needs to be proportional to your brain processing speed. Processing speed increases as you gradually expose yourself to the limit of traction. So you can more often and with less danger exercise your brain and coordination with hard tires. Once you master 300 Tredwear try 200 TW. Dont go to RComps untill you are comfortable sideways in most if not all corners. Making your car faster will increase the time it will take to become a competent driver.
If you dont study the rules your instructor will have to teach them too you instead of teaching you how to drive well.
01-24-2019, 08:50 AM
#23
Registered User
Thread Starter
01-24-2019, 09:05 AM
#24
A couple of loose ends worth mentioning.
For novice drivers with an instructor, taken from the SCDA site: "Both passenger and driver side seat belts should be fully functional and the same restraint system must be used for both driver and passenger." NASA-NE has the same rule, I believe, as do most other organizations that provide instructors.
For use of a HANS device, one normally needs a harness bar and a race harness - meaning race seats, roll bar and harnesses, plus the HANS. Short of that, OP may want to consider using a hybrid FHR instead. See https://driver61.com/resources/hans-...-buyers-guide/
For novice drivers with an instructor, taken from the SCDA site: "Both passenger and driver side seat belts should be fully functional and the same restraint system must be used for both driver and passenger." NASA-NE has the same rule, I believe, as do most other organizations that provide instructors.
For use of a HANS device, one normally needs a harness bar and a race harness - meaning race seats, roll bar and harnesses, plus the HANS. Short of that, OP may want to consider using a hybrid FHR instead. See https://driver61.com/resources/hans-...-buyers-guide/
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ThisIsRace (01-24-2019)
01-24-2019, 09:18 AM
#25
Registered User
Thread Starter
A couple of loose ends worth mentioning.
For novice drivers with an instructor, taken from the SCDA site: "Both passenger and driver side seat belts should be fully functional and the same restraint system must be used for both driver and passenger." NASA-NE has the same rule, I believe, as do most other organizations that provide instructors.
For use of a HANS device, one normally needs a harness bar and a race harness - meaning race seats, roll bar and harnesses, plus the HANS. Short of that, OP may want to consider using a hybrid FHR instead. See https://driver61.com/resources/hans-...-buyers-guide/
For novice drivers with an instructor, taken from the SCDA site: "Both passenger and driver side seat belts should be fully functional and the same restraint system must be used for both driver and passenger." NASA-NE has the same rule, I believe, as do most other organizations that provide instructors.
For use of a HANS device, one normally needs a harness bar and a race harness - meaning race seats, roll bar and harnesses, plus the HANS. Short of that, OP may want to consider using a hybrid FHR instead. See https://driver61.com/resources/hans-...-buyers-guide/
I really would like to go with Recaros because they seem to have better OEM mounting options for the S2k.
Apparently the difference between Hans Complaint seats is that they have an indentation at the top so that your head isn't leaning forward
01-24-2019, 09:21 AM
#26
Registered User
Thread Starter
Years ago, Nofearofdanger posted this up on these boards: (sorry about how it looks)
Everyone who has the opportunity to get out on the track should do so. …It's not just the driving, it's everything else that comes along with it.… The new friends you make up there. The sound of cars with tuned exhausts and intakes screaming down the main straight.The smell of burnt petrol, meandering through the air and tickling the nose with a sense of great familiarity.The sight of cars attacking corners like there's no tomorrow.It really is like nothing else.The laughter, the foolishness, the enthusiasm, the passion.It all comes together to give you an unexplainable feeling.…It's a petrol-head's sensory delight.…
Engine singing like an angry demon, brake hard, the nose of the car dips as the mass transfers onto the front axle and your neck resists against the longitudinal G-forces. Enter the corner, look for the apex.Turn hard. Clip it.Lateral G-forces generated by your Direzzas push and pull on your entire body.Slowly ease on the gas as corner exit, then wide open as the car is pointing forwards.An assault on your physical and mental stamina, but in the most glorious of ways.
When you're on the track, nothing else matters.You don't have to clock an amazing time.You don't have to be modified. You can be a professional or a first timer.All of life's problems seem to wither away into nothingness. The magic occurs when everything amalgamates together into something beyond physical or mental experience. The track allows the car and driver to unite into one, more than you could on the street.It allows you to push that crucial 10% harder.It is worlds apart from street driving.It stirs the soul, deeply, just like Soichiro intended.At the end of the day, you have little to show for what you have just experienced.You're tired as hell, your tires are cooked, your brakes are worn, and countless litres of petrol have been burned but nothing in the world can wipe that smile off your face.
Everyone who has the opportunity to get out on the track should do so. …It's not just the driving, it's everything else that comes along with it.… The new friends you make up there. The sound of cars with tuned exhausts and intakes screaming down the main straight.The smell of burnt petrol, meandering through the air and tickling the nose with a sense of great familiarity.The sight of cars attacking corners like there's no tomorrow.It really is like nothing else.The laughter, the foolishness, the enthusiasm, the passion.It all comes together to give you an unexplainable feeling.…It's a petrol-head's sensory delight.…
Engine singing like an angry demon, brake hard, the nose of the car dips as the mass transfers onto the front axle and your neck resists against the longitudinal G-forces. Enter the corner, look for the apex.Turn hard. Clip it.Lateral G-forces generated by your Direzzas push and pull on your entire body.Slowly ease on the gas as corner exit, then wide open as the car is pointing forwards.An assault on your physical and mental stamina, but in the most glorious of ways.
When you're on the track, nothing else matters.You don't have to clock an amazing time.You don't have to be modified. You can be a professional or a first timer.All of life's problems seem to wither away into nothingness. The magic occurs when everything amalgamates together into something beyond physical or mental experience. The track allows the car and driver to unite into one, more than you could on the street.It allows you to push that crucial 10% harder.It is worlds apart from street driving.It stirs the soul, deeply, just like Soichiro intended.At the end of the day, you have little to show for what you have just experienced.You're tired as hell, your tires are cooked, your brakes are worn, and countless litres of petrol have been burned but nothing in the world can wipe that smile off your face.
01-24-2019, 09:31 AM
#27
Community Organizer
01-24-2019, 09:31 AM
#28
Not sure if this will answer your question.
I've seen a lot of instructors using the Hybrid FHR because many if not most novices are running stock seats and belts. I think you can use the Hybrid FHR's with just about any seat. I don't have the hybrid myself, but have thought about getting one for use in the stock S2000 for track days.
I think the issue with HANS compliant seats has to do with where the shoulder harness straps come through the seat because it is these straps that hold the HANS in place. There is a specified angle that the straps are supposed to have as they come up and over the shoulder. If you go with the HANS, consider getting HANS compatible shoulder straps. As opposed to 3" wide straps, these come down in sort of a dogbone shape so that the strap is only 2" wide where it sits on the HANS device.
And if you are going the whole nine yards. you might also consider pull up lap belts versus pull down belts for your harness. Most budget belts are pull down to tighten. I like the pull up to tighten belts as I find it easier to get them super tight.
I've seen a lot of instructors using the Hybrid FHR because many if not most novices are running stock seats and belts. I think you can use the Hybrid FHR's with just about any seat. I don't have the hybrid myself, but have thought about getting one for use in the stock S2000 for track days.
I think the issue with HANS compliant seats has to do with where the shoulder harness straps come through the seat because it is these straps that hold the HANS in place. There is a specified angle that the straps are supposed to have as they come up and over the shoulder. If you go with the HANS, consider getting HANS compatible shoulder straps. As opposed to 3" wide straps, these come down in sort of a dogbone shape so that the strap is only 2" wide where it sits on the HANS device.
And if you are going the whole nine yards. you might also consider pull up lap belts versus pull down belts for your harness. Most budget belts are pull down to tighten. I like the pull up to tighten belts as I find it easier to get them super tight.
01-24-2019, 09:59 AM
#29
Registered User
Thread Starter
Awesome, very psyched!
It sure did, I saw that about the straps as well, but the pull up is a good tip. I'm 5'8" so from what I'm reading on racing forums I shouldn't have a big problem with the strap location but I definitely think the indent for it would make driving much more comfortable.
From what I see, the Hybrid FHR seems to be a bit more user friendly. There's lots to account for with the HANS; the distance between harness straps, size of straps, distance from head to HANS, distance from HANS to seat, angle of Hans. I'm going to talk to some guys I know that run Nascar Modifieds to see if I can try on one of their HANS for size. Seems like a hard thing to buy online but I'm sure I can figure it out.
Not sure if this will answer your question.
I've seen a lot of instructors using the Hybrid FHR because many if not most novices are running stock seats and belts. I think you can use the Hybrid FHR's with just about any seat. I don't have the hybrid myself, but have thought about getting one for use in the stock S2000 for track days.
I think the issue with HANS compliant seats has to do with where the shoulder harness straps come through the seat because it is these straps that hold the HANS in place. There is a specified angle that the straps are supposed to have as they come up and over the shoulder. If you go with the HANS, consider getting HANS compatible shoulder straps. As opposed to 3" wide straps, these come down in sort of a dogbone shape so that the strap is only 2" wide where it sits on the HANS device.
And if you are going the whole nine yards. you might also consider pull up lap belts versus pull down belts for your harness. Most budget belts are pull down to tighten. I like the pull up to tighten belts as I find it easier to get them super tight.
I've seen a lot of instructors using the Hybrid FHR because many if not most novices are running stock seats and belts. I think you can use the Hybrid FHR's with just about any seat. I don't have the hybrid myself, but have thought about getting one for use in the stock S2000 for track days.
I think the issue with HANS compliant seats has to do with where the shoulder harness straps come through the seat because it is these straps that hold the HANS in place. There is a specified angle that the straps are supposed to have as they come up and over the shoulder. If you go with the HANS, consider getting HANS compatible shoulder straps. As opposed to 3" wide straps, these come down in sort of a dogbone shape so that the strap is only 2" wide where it sits on the HANS device.
And if you are going the whole nine yards. you might also consider pull up lap belts versus pull down belts for your harness. Most budget belts are pull down to tighten. I like the pull up to tighten belts as I find it easier to get them super tight.
From what I see, the Hybrid FHR seems to be a bit more user friendly. There's lots to account for with the HANS; the distance between harness straps, size of straps, distance from head to HANS, distance from HANS to seat, angle of Hans. I'm going to talk to some guys I know that run Nascar Modifieds to see if I can try on one of their HANS for size. Seems like a hard thing to buy online but I'm sure I can figure it out.
01-24-2019, 12:23 PM
#30
Don't forget you have special StopTech pricing all season for participating in the TakeOver events. Contact AZP or I can get you the prices on the lines and whatever else you need!
The following users liked this post:
ThisIsRace (01-24-2019)