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want better turn in

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Old Oct 29, 2011 | 09:23 PM
  #11  
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as for springs and dampers:

given condition of local roads i can't drive with much stiffere settings.
when i go from my normal 13 to 10 (16 the softest) it's about as stiff as local roads allow.
on track i go even to 5 - but then i need to avoid curbs otherwise car get's quite hard hits.

softer front spiings?
i think Tein have 10kg springs available.
but i can try first stiffer setting of rear sway...

i'm afraid it will make the car too eversteary
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Old Oct 30, 2011 | 05:57 AM
  #12  
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Originally Posted by Croc
Originally Posted by robrob' timestamp='1319931020' post='21112922
Why are you running toe-out up front? I'd start here and go to factory spec 0 front toe.
i always been told that toe out is good for turns.
isn't it?
It is kinda car dependent. It has been shown time and time again that the best front toe setting on these cars is 0, I believe these cars toe out under compression, so you are already going to get some toe out when slowing into a turn, so putting more toe out in makes it go too far.

Other possible culprits:
If you have plenty of grip but the turn in feels sluggish, you can try stiffening up the front shocks. Also R1R's have a pretty soft sidewall and flex a bit which makes the turn in feel less crisp and immediate, Dunlop Star Specs would give a more immediate feel (Hankook RS3's should as well)

If you have decent feel but are loosing grip on turn in: First it may be you, entering a corner too fast or with too abrupt of a steering input results in understeer, so you may be doing that. Another, is you live in a very hot country, R1R's really don't handle heat that well, and the S2000 is heavier than most of the cars that have success with the R1R, so the tires may be getting overheated (Dunlop Star Specs handle heat a little better but no street tire handles heat as well as the Hankook RS3). As far as suspension changes 0 front toe, softer front shock settings, softer front sway bar setting, Softer front springs (maybe try swapping your front and rear springs around). (it is best to fix the end of the car that has the problem as opposed to unsticking the end that doesnt)
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Old Oct 30, 2011 | 06:17 AM
  #13  
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In addition to zero front tow and better tires, I would consider increasing your caster.
In a turn more caster increases negative camber on outside tire, and reduces negative camber on the inside tire.
With the electric power steering of the S2000, I doubt you will feel much difference.
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Old Oct 30, 2011 | 06:43 AM
  #14  
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Originally Posted by TTMartin
In addition to zero front tow and better tires, I would consider increasing your caster.
In a turn more caster increases negative camber on outside tire, and reduces negative camber on the inside tire.
With the electric power steering of the S2000, I doubt you will feel much difference.
This is true, but I seriously doubt it will help with turn in at all, because the changes are so subtle at low steering angle that I doubt there will be much of a difference in camber. IMHO this helps more mid corner with very tight radius turns as opposed to initial turn in.
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Old Oct 30, 2011 | 07:01 AM
  #15  
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You have 5mm total rear toe? That's a lot
Knock it down to 1-2mm total. That should provide a noticeable improvement in turn-in.
In my experience, too much rear toe sucks, for everything.
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Old Oct 30, 2011 | 07:05 AM
  #16  
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You can pull spring from the front, play with the sway bars, or lower the front more, or raise the rear.
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Old Oct 30, 2011 | 09:03 AM
  #17  
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It seems like some of the suggestions are more towards overall balance vs just an entry issue.

Initial entry feel or speed wont be solved by running a softer front spring unless you're running too much spring and in his case he's not.


To the OP don't go and change too much, you said you like the way the car is so first try the damper adjustment since its the easiest and least expensive then try running 0 front toe next. If you're not getting the turn in feel you want then try different tires, if none of those work then post up a video.
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Old Oct 30, 2011 | 09:54 AM
  #18  
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I had the same problems on my tein Monoflex. The suspension not only pushes on corner entry, but mid corner as well. I played with the dampers a lot, and I still couldn't get the handling where I wanted. I was running -2.2 f and -2.6 rear camber. The front tires were wearing and heating up more on the outside shoulders during hard track days. The rears were bang on. An extra -.5 of neg camber up front might help as well. But that was specific to my car. You should measure tire temperatures right aftet your track session. You could start with changing the front spring rate to 10k, and see how that works. As other guys have said, always change the end of the car that is causing the problem. Having said that, I would actually bump the rear spring rates up to 12k to match the fronts. These dampers have absolutely no compression damping, and I would not run softer springs. The front end was already folding under high cornering loads, running oem size staggered re11's. I have since upgraded to Motons, so I never got the chance to experiment with mine.
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Old Oct 30, 2011 | 10:27 AM
  #19  
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Would adding rake help?
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Old Oct 30, 2011 | 12:13 PM
  #20  
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Originally Posted by ZDan
You have 5mm total rear toe? That's a lot
Knock it down to 1-2mm total. That should provide a noticeable improvement in turn-in.
In my experience, too much rear toe sucks, for everything.
i remembere you'd recommended 0.2-0.3 degr.
my calculation was that 5 mm is ~0.25 degr.
so how much is it?
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