fla-y2ks2k

I stopped by my local dealer (Coral Springs Honda) today to talk to the service department, notify them that I had the 2nd intermittent gear grind problem and have them order the appropriate parts and schedule the repair. The service rep knew about the bulletin, but advised me that I'd have to schedule a time to bring the car in so they could "verify that I in fact had the problem" before they could order the parts.

I asked "Exactly how do you verify an INTERMITTENT grind that only occurs during HIGH RPM shifts?"... No answer. I told him there were only two ways that it could be verified...1) take my word for it or 2) drive the car and do enough high speed shifts until the problem occurred.

I then told him it would be a cold day in hell when I dropped my car off and let anyone there do enough 9k shifts until the problem was reproduced, so he turned me over to the service manager, and I told him the same thing. He said that they at least had to TRY to reproduce the problem, so I said fine, I'll come in, your tech can ride with me and we'll go joy riding for as long as it takes to reproduce the problem... which day do you have a rep free all day to go riding with me?

He laughed, and we agreed that I'll come in, I'll drive, and one of the reps will ride along for a little while and I'll try to reproduce the problem. However, as I pointed out, it is, according to their own bulletin, and INTERMITTENT problem and there's no guarantee that I'll reproduce it in 10 minutes, 1 hour, or even in a whole day. That still doesn't mean the problem doesn't exist! He said we'd try, and if we couldn't reproduce it, he'd "probably" order the parts anyway. I'm scheduled to go in Tuesday.

I'm going to call Torrance on Monday and see if this nonsense is really necessary. If anyone has the contacts name for the South Florida area I'd appreciate it. If not, I'll get it!

[This message has been edited by fla-y2ks2k (edited October 14, 2000).]

[This message has been edited by fla-y2ks2k (edited October 14, 2000).]

cdelena

Yes, I agree it is a real problem. Especially now that the temperature is cooling. It was relatively easy to reproduce it on mine when it was 90F+ but it would take some driving now. Mine and the other two I experienced would grind when very hot even at low rpm.. I did not have to do 9K shifts for a grind.. if you do it is gonna be an interesting check-out ride.

Sondra S2K

If anyone still has the TSB for this scanned in, I'd love to have it... can you email it to me at VAn8v@aol.com or just post it?

Thanks...

Strike

I don't understand why the dealer would even question you. This is a warranty issue, therefore the dealer gets paid by Honda to do the repairs. Do they actually think you're just bringing your car in for major tranny work for no reason? Is there something in the Service Bulleting that directs the dealership to "verify" an "intermittent" problem? I think the dealership is just being a pain in your butt and I hope the regional office takes care of this for you.

TFota

Sondra, I'd never thought I'd have to suggest that you use the search function!

I already asked someone to post it here. You can find it in this thread: http://www.s2000online.com/forums/showthre...php?threadid=20

fla-y2ks2k

I told them to warn whoever they sent that the ride was going to be "spirited". Fortunatey the grind is between first and second, and not between fourth and fifth! To me it's totally ridiculous to put the customer through this... intermittent means intermittent. I think I'll take them a Webster's dictionary. By its very definition it will be tough to replicate!

CoralDoc

fla-y2ks2k - I'll be VERY interested to hear what they do for you at CSAM. I was in there last week and the service tech told me that I was the only one that had reported a 2nd gear grind problem. Not 5 minutes into our conversation, a Silver S2K rolled in and the owner brought up the very same issue .

I won't be able to take my car in for about a month, so I'd like to hear about your experience. I will say that they were very cordial about it and promised that they would take care of me.

fla-y2ks2k

The rep I talked with (Barry) knew exactly which bulletin I was referring to. The manager I spoke (Jim) with didn't, and Barry showed it to him. I'm going to place a call first thing Monday morning and talk to the "top dog" in service, whoever that may be, and if I don't get any satisfaction, I'll fax then call our customer relations zone office in Atlanta (page 255 in the manual that I never read). Since this is my "play" car and not my daily driver, I have time to play their silly game.

honda_s2k

I had a very similar experience. Neither the NE Zone Office, the Honda National Office or my dealer "knew" about the TSB 10 days ago. No tranny problems or grinds in their database. BS! I was then told by Honda US to contact the dealer and report the problem (for the fourth time!).

When I called the dealership back, I was told that I needed to reproduce the grind before they could authorize any work. I explained to them that it occurs randomly, usually after extended highway driving with warm ambient temperatures. I asked that a tech or service manager be immediately available when I arrived because the test drive needed to occur with a hot gear box.

I was at the dealer yesterday to reproduce the grind for them. I took my car for a long, ~60 mile ride at high speed prior to showing up. The car then sat in the lot cooling down for 45 minutes before they could find someone for a test drive , the shop floor foreman. I drove this guy around for at least a half hour before the grind happened. It was like the 3rd of 4th 1-2 shift, overall. I had to warm things up again. He was then satisfied and we headed back to the lot.

BTW, when I pulled out the TSB to show it to the service writer, he told me that he had already seen it. I told him that it must have just come in because it didn't "exist" when I called a week and half ago. I also then found out that they have already fixed one S2K for one of the department managers who works at the dealership, and that his was done three weeks ago! This manager told me this in a casual conversation we had while I was waiting for my car to returned (I had them do the 7.5K oil change/service while I was there). What kind of BS is this!?!

fla-y2ks2k

Now that I think about it that's when it normally has happened to me. I still think that having to prove an intermittent problem is just plain stupid, and I'm going to cause a stink upstream and see what happens. It's the principal of the thing. What if it were an intermittent brake failure problem??? Who would volunteer to do that test drive?

I own a software development company. I can just imagine what would happen if we had a bug that was difficult to reproduce, and only happened under certain conditions, and we admitted that we had the problem and the fix, but we would only give our users the fix if and when they could show us that they could reproduce the problem (how's that for a run-on sentence???) My phone would be ringing off the hook!

Let's see what happens when I call their bluff.