anyone sold their s2 for an m3?
03-17-2009, 01:55 AM
#71
Since I'm assuming a used purchase, a good question would be to ask:
What's the average life expectancy of each of these BMWs?
It's not difficult to find cheaper E46/36 with relatively high miles, but then as Honda owners, that'd be no problem to us. =P
What's the average life expectancy of each of these BMWs?
It's not difficult to find cheaper E46/36 with relatively high miles, but then as Honda owners, that'd be no problem to us. =P
03-17-2009, 07:05 AM
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I was researching this same topic recently, since the '04-'06 M3's seem to be getting fairly cheap these days.
The thing that finally occurred to me is that, regardless of CPO status, there is a massive drop in price/value right around the expiration of the factory 50k warranty. My research seemed to back that up.
First off, the mounting points for the rear subframe are a suspected weakness in the E46 chassis. So much so that a cottage industry has popped up offering weld-in braces to reinforce the chassis. It seems like this is a popular mod for the M3 crowd.
The next issue that may or may not be systemic to the E46 M3's engine is VANOS failure. It seems to happen right after a valve adjustment, so I suspect that it is caused by a shortcut taken by the mechanic during the adjustment. In the end, the face of the cam adjuster shears off and either plugs up the VANOS unit ($1k-$3k replacement,) or takes out the motor.
Finally, the transmission is a sealed unit from Getrag. After my nightmare experience with the 300GT VR-4 and its "sealed" Getrag unit, I have reservations about returning to that maintenance paradigm.
I was particularly interested in the SMG, but that seems to bring its own host of issues, not limited to throwout-fork bushing failure taking out the clutch actuator (basically an automated slave-cylinder,) and pressure-plate/clutch assembly. Also, the hydraulic pumps (as noted, in the $1500-$2k range) seem to have their share of issues as well.
In the end, even before a test-drive, I just had to abandon the idea. There are just too many systemic issues for me to be willing to take the risk. If I could buy out-of-pocket, I would consider it. Financing? No way.
Good luck to all, but hop over to www.m3forum.com and just do a search on VANOS failure. It's becoming regular enough at this point (and provides zero warning of failure,) that I wouldn't consider an E46 M3 unless, as I said, I bought it for cash.
Mike
The thing that finally occurred to me is that, regardless of CPO status, there is a massive drop in price/value right around the expiration of the factory 50k warranty. My research seemed to back that up.
First off, the mounting points for the rear subframe are a suspected weakness in the E46 chassis. So much so that a cottage industry has popped up offering weld-in braces to reinforce the chassis. It seems like this is a popular mod for the M3 crowd.
The next issue that may or may not be systemic to the E46 M3's engine is VANOS failure. It seems to happen right after a valve adjustment, so I suspect that it is caused by a shortcut taken by the mechanic during the adjustment. In the end, the face of the cam adjuster shears off and either plugs up the VANOS unit ($1k-$3k replacement,) or takes out the motor.
Finally, the transmission is a sealed unit from Getrag. After my nightmare experience with the 300GT VR-4 and its "sealed" Getrag unit, I have reservations about returning to that maintenance paradigm.
I was particularly interested in the SMG, but that seems to bring its own host of issues, not limited to throwout-fork bushing failure taking out the clutch actuator (basically an automated slave-cylinder,) and pressure-plate/clutch assembly. Also, the hydraulic pumps (as noted, in the $1500-$2k range) seem to have their share of issues as well.
In the end, even before a test-drive, I just had to abandon the idea. There are just too many systemic issues for me to be willing to take the risk. If I could buy out-of-pocket, I would consider it. Financing? No way.
Good luck to all, but hop over to www.m3forum.com and just do a search on VANOS failure. It's becoming regular enough at this point (and provides zero warning of failure,) that I wouldn't consider an E46 M3 unless, as I said, I bought it for cash.
Mike
03-17-2009, 01:19 PM
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Originally Posted by mitsu13gman,Mar 17 2009, 07:05 AM
I was researching this same topic recently, since the '04-'06 M3's seem to be getting fairly cheap these days.
The thing that finally occurred to me is that, regardless of CPO status, there is a massive drop in price/value right around the expiration of the factory 50k warranty. My research seemed to back that up.
First off, the mounting points for the rear subframe are a suspected weakness in the E46 chassis. So much so that a cottage industry has popped up offering weld-in braces to reinforce the chassis. It seems like this is a popular mod for the M3 crowd.
The next issue that may or may not be systemic to the E46 M3's engine is VANOS failure. It seems to happen right after a valve adjustment, so I suspect that it is caused by a shortcut taken by the mechanic during the adjustment. In the end, the face of the cam adjuster shears off and either plugs up the VANOS unit ($1k-$3k replacement,) or takes out the motor.
Finally, the transmission is a sealed unit from Getrag. After my nightmare experience with the 300GT VR-4 and its "sealed" Getrag unit, I have reservations about returning to that maintenance paradigm.
I was particularly interested in the SMG, but that seems to bring its own host of issues, not limited to throwout-fork bushing failure taking out the clutch actuator (basically an automated slave-cylinder,) and pressure-plate/clutch assembly. Also, the hydraulic pumps (as noted, in the $1500-$2k range) seem to have their share of issues as well.
In the end, even before a test-drive, I just had to abandon the idea. There are just too many systemic issues for me to be willing to take the risk. If I could buy out-of-pocket, I would consider it. Financing? No way.
Good luck to all, but hop over to www.m3forum.com and just do a search on VANOS failure. It's becoming regular enough at this point (and provides zero warning of failure,) that I wouldn't consider an E46 M3 unless, as I said, I bought it for cash.
Mike
The thing that finally occurred to me is that, regardless of CPO status, there is a massive drop in price/value right around the expiration of the factory 50k warranty. My research seemed to back that up.
First off, the mounting points for the rear subframe are a suspected weakness in the E46 chassis. So much so that a cottage industry has popped up offering weld-in braces to reinforce the chassis. It seems like this is a popular mod for the M3 crowd.
The next issue that may or may not be systemic to the E46 M3's engine is VANOS failure. It seems to happen right after a valve adjustment, so I suspect that it is caused by a shortcut taken by the mechanic during the adjustment. In the end, the face of the cam adjuster shears off and either plugs up the VANOS unit ($1k-$3k replacement,) or takes out the motor.
Finally, the transmission is a sealed unit from Getrag. After my nightmare experience with the 300GT VR-4 and its "sealed" Getrag unit, I have reservations about returning to that maintenance paradigm.
I was particularly interested in the SMG, but that seems to bring its own host of issues, not limited to throwout-fork bushing failure taking out the clutch actuator (basically an automated slave-cylinder,) and pressure-plate/clutch assembly. Also, the hydraulic pumps (as noted, in the $1500-$2k range) seem to have their share of issues as well.
In the end, even before a test-drive, I just had to abandon the idea. There are just too many systemic issues for me to be willing to take the risk. If I could buy out-of-pocket, I would consider it. Financing? No way.
Good luck to all, but hop over to www.m3forum.com and just do a search on VANOS failure. It's becoming regular enough at this point (and provides zero warning of failure,) that I wouldn't consider an E46 M3 unless, as I said, I bought it for cash.
Mike
03-17-2009, 01:59 PM
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Originally Posted by mitsu13gman,Mar 17 2009, 07:05 AM
I was researching this same topic recently, since the '04-'06 M3's seem to be getting fairly cheap these days.
The thing that finally occurred to me is that, regardless of CPO status, there is a massive drop in price/value right around the expiration of the factory 50k warranty. My research seemed to back that up.
First off, the mounting points for the rear subframe are a suspected weakness in the E46 chassis. So much so that a cottage industry has popped up offering weld-in braces to reinforce the chassis. It seems like this is a popular mod for the M3 crowd.
The next issue that may or may not be systemic to the E46 M3's engine is VANOS failure. It seems to happen right after a valve adjustment, so I suspect that it is caused by a shortcut taken by the mechanic during the adjustment. In the end, the face of the cam adjuster shears off and either plugs up the VANOS unit ($1k-$3k replacement,) or takes out the motor.
Finally, the transmission is a sealed unit from Getrag. After my nightmare experience with the 300GT VR-4 and its "sealed" Getrag unit, I have reservations about returning to that maintenance paradigm.
I was particularly interested in the SMG, but that seems to bring its own host of issues, not limited to throwout-fork bushing failure taking out the clutch actuator (basically an automated slave-cylinder,) and pressure-plate/clutch assembly. Also, the hydraulic pumps (as noted, in the $1500-$2k range) seem to have their share of issues as well.
In the end, even before a test-drive, I just had to abandon the idea. There are just too many systemic issues for me to be willing to take the risk. If I could buy out-of-pocket, I would consider it. Financing? No way.
Good luck to all, but hop over to www.m3forum.com and just do a search on VANOS failure. It's becoming regular enough at this point (and provides zero warning of failure,) that I wouldn't consider an E46 M3 unless, as I said, I bought it for cash.
Mike
The thing that finally occurred to me is that, regardless of CPO status, there is a massive drop in price/value right around the expiration of the factory 50k warranty. My research seemed to back that up.
First off, the mounting points for the rear subframe are a suspected weakness in the E46 chassis. So much so that a cottage industry has popped up offering weld-in braces to reinforce the chassis. It seems like this is a popular mod for the M3 crowd.
The next issue that may or may not be systemic to the E46 M3's engine is VANOS failure. It seems to happen right after a valve adjustment, so I suspect that it is caused by a shortcut taken by the mechanic during the adjustment. In the end, the face of the cam adjuster shears off and either plugs up the VANOS unit ($1k-$3k replacement,) or takes out the motor.
Finally, the transmission is a sealed unit from Getrag. After my nightmare experience with the 300GT VR-4 and its "sealed" Getrag unit, I have reservations about returning to that maintenance paradigm.
I was particularly interested in the SMG, but that seems to bring its own host of issues, not limited to throwout-fork bushing failure taking out the clutch actuator (basically an automated slave-cylinder,) and pressure-plate/clutch assembly. Also, the hydraulic pumps (as noted, in the $1500-$2k range) seem to have their share of issues as well.
In the end, even before a test-drive, I just had to abandon the idea. There are just too many systemic issues for me to be willing to take the risk. If I could buy out-of-pocket, I would consider it. Financing? No way.
Good luck to all, but hop over to www.m3forum.com and just do a search on VANOS failure. It's becoming regular enough at this point (and provides zero warning of failure,) that I wouldn't consider an E46 M3 unless, as I said, I bought it for cash.
Mike
03-17-2009, 03:22 PM
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Originally Posted by mitsu13gman,Mar 17 2009, 07:05 AM
I was researching this same topic recently, since the '04-'06 M3's seem to be getting fairly cheap these days.
The thing that finally occurred to me is that, regardless of CPO status, there is a massive drop in price/value right around the expiration of the factory 50k warranty. My research seemed to back that up.
First off, the mounting points for the rear subframe are a suspected weakness in the E46 chassis. So much so that a cottage industry has popped up offering weld-in braces to reinforce the chassis. It seems like this is a popular mod for the M3 crowd.
The next issue that may or may not be systemic to the E46 M3's engine is VANOS failure. It seems to happen right after a valve adjustment, so I suspect that it is caused by a shortcut taken by the mechanic during the adjustment. In the end, the face of the cam adjuster shears off and either plugs up the VANOS unit ($1k-$3k replacement,) or takes out the motor.
Finally, the transmission is a sealed unit from Getrag. After my nightmare experience with the 300GT VR-4 and its "sealed" Getrag unit, I have reservations about returning to that maintenance paradigm.
I was particularly interested in the SMG, but that seems to bring its own host of issues, not limited to throwout-fork bushing failure taking out the clutch actuator (basically an automated slave-cylinder,) and pressure-plate/clutch assembly. Also, the hydraulic pumps (as noted, in the $1500-$2k range) seem to have their share of issues as well.
In the end, even before a test-drive, I just had to abandon the idea. There are just too many systemic issues for me to be willing to take the risk. If I could buy out-of-pocket, I would consider it. Financing? No way.
Good luck to all, but hop over to www.m3forum.com and just do a search on VANOS failure. It's becoming regular enough at this point (and provides zero warning of failure,) that I wouldn't consider an E46 M3 unless, as I said, I bought it for cash.
Mike
The thing that finally occurred to me is that, regardless of CPO status, there is a massive drop in price/value right around the expiration of the factory 50k warranty. My research seemed to back that up.
First off, the mounting points for the rear subframe are a suspected weakness in the E46 chassis. So much so that a cottage industry has popped up offering weld-in braces to reinforce the chassis. It seems like this is a popular mod for the M3 crowd.
The next issue that may or may not be systemic to the E46 M3's engine is VANOS failure. It seems to happen right after a valve adjustment, so I suspect that it is caused by a shortcut taken by the mechanic during the adjustment. In the end, the face of the cam adjuster shears off and either plugs up the VANOS unit ($1k-$3k replacement,) or takes out the motor.
Finally, the transmission is a sealed unit from Getrag. After my nightmare experience with the 300GT VR-4 and its "sealed" Getrag unit, I have reservations about returning to that maintenance paradigm.
I was particularly interested in the SMG, but that seems to bring its own host of issues, not limited to throwout-fork bushing failure taking out the clutch actuator (basically an automated slave-cylinder,) and pressure-plate/clutch assembly. Also, the hydraulic pumps (as noted, in the $1500-$2k range) seem to have their share of issues as well.
In the end, even before a test-drive, I just had to abandon the idea. There are just too many systemic issues for me to be willing to take the risk. If I could buy out-of-pocket, I would consider it. Financing? No way.
Good luck to all, but hop over to www.m3forum.com and just do a search on VANOS failure. It's becoming regular enough at this point (and provides zero warning of failure,) that I wouldn't consider an E46 M3 unless, as I said, I bought it for cash.
Mike
03-17-2009, 07:41 PM
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I have considered it, the M3 is a hot car.
The main reason I haven't yet is a combination of love for my current car and not wanting to put down a lot of money for a M3 in this economy.
Until the economy settles I'm not sure how much cash I will have in 6 months time.
The main reason I haven't yet is a combination of love for my current car and not wanting to put down a lot of money for a M3 in this economy.
Until the economy settles I'm not sure how much cash I will have in 6 months time.
04-07-2009, 06:57 PM
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Have you made up your mind or gonna do both? That would be a hot driveway with both cars. That picture of the m3, s2000 and gt3 is from a member on Bimmerforums, maybe here as well.
You could go with the best of both worlds like this m3 honda which was recently on ebay.....
Here's my dad's s2000 when i went home for a weekend and mine.
You could go with the best of both worlds like this m3 honda which was recently on ebay.....
Here's my dad's s2000 when i went home for a weekend and mine.
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