Those people are using VSA as a trigger to let them know when they are exceeding a certain threshold and I don't have a problem with that at all.

The problem is you are too good of a driver to see the faults in the system and haven't hung out with enough stupid kids or middle-aged wannabes.

Many of these people "ride" their stability systems and rely on them to get through every corner. In the case of a car like the EVO or a Carerra 4 you can basically mash the gas around every corner and the car will find a way around it the vast majority of the time. But in certain circumstances the car can't save you and since you don't truly know how to drive the car, you can't either. Then again you never know maybe this is a better result than no stability management at all if you look at accident rates from a statistical point of view. I don't have the answer to that question.

Now I have another problem with the VSA as well which I will only apply to myself and not others and that is I think it is too restrictive even as a threshold notification device, especially on the track. But to each their own there.

 

I understand what you mean carrera4 with the reference with vsa and canyon runs. Someone without driving experience in the s2000 probably shouldnt be putting themselves in a potentially dangerous situation in the first place if they dont feel comfortable with the s2000's limits. Learn the car first IMO.

Honestly I will probably end up turning it off if the next time i go on a canyon run, because i feel i dont need it in that situation. I am not saying i am Michael Schumaker" behind the wheel of the s2k, its just that in a sprinted situation i want to be in control of the car without the nannies at my back. It would take away from the driving experience.

I feel the vsa is helpful in the daily and in situations where traction may be limited or have the potential to be limited. With the s2000 i feel its a welcome addition for safety on the street.

 

So it's recommended to take out the CDV? What kind of improvement do you get out of that? Can any Honda dealership do it for you?

 

lol the dealer will definitely not want you to remove the CDV. The CDV causes the clutch to engage slowly on highrpm quick shifts causing the clutch to slip. Combined with the heavy ap2 flywheel and the weak pressure plate you have your self one slippy clutch system.

if you want an easy way to get rid of it, buy an ap1 clutch slave cyl and install it on place of the ap2 one and you'll be good to go.

 

The incidents I referenced are not "one-in-a-million". They happen with some regularity (hopefully less moving forward). That said, I don't think ABS is necessarily more of a hindrance than a benefit for the street. But I do think its efficacy on the street is greatly overestimated by most people.

Anyway, speaking of "one-in-a-million" scenarios:[QUOTE]let's say you are on a twisty back road, come around a blind corner and hit a patch of sand that sends the back end of the car wide.

 

I've never driven an S2000 w/ DBW, but the implementation in my Cayman S is spot on, and I have 2 throttle maps (sport and normal) to add to the fun. I like it better than a cable for that reason - it's very aggressive when you want it to be, or can have a slower ramp for parking lots and heavy traffic.

I'll never complain about stability control as long as it's fully defeatable...I only turn mine off on the track.

 

There is no substitute for judgement and skilled car control, but if I'm desiging a cr for the general public, I'd be a fool to expect either one. Only a small percentage of the car buying public ever learns car control skills beyond what they need to get from point A to point B, and then only if nothing too bad happens along the way. It's actually pretty hard to underestimate the driving skill of the average motorist.

It seems to me that you are looking at the best drivers, and the worst stability control systems, and comparing them, and that just isn't fair. Compare the best to the best. Nobody, absolutely nobody, can go faster in an F1 car by turning the traction control systems off. Compare average to average. The average driver is better off with the average stability control system than he is when left to his own devices.

A goood, tunable, traction (and/or stability) control system can make a good driver quicker, and almost anything that helps out the average Joe when he gets into trouble is a good thing.
Doesn't that make sense, ZDan?

[QUOTE]It is also worth considering that systems that take over at the limit of driver talent actively prevent the driver from learning how to drive at the limit.

 

People take more risk when they have safety nets.

"Airbags and ABS safety questioned

A Purdue University research team that studied five years of motor vehicle accidents in Washington State came to the conclusion that antilock brakes and airbags don't really minimize accidents or injuries because those systems may encourage more aggressive driving. Fred Mannering, a Purdue professor of civil engineering, led the study, calls this behavior

 

So, what's you point? People make an informed desision based on their current options. As long as they understand that VSA can't break Newtons Laws of Motion, they'll be fine. Argueing that VSA is bad because someone might actually use it, is a little silly. Of course you're also asking how to disable antilock brakes, so maybe you're beyond help.

This is kind-of funny that quote. How could Airbags have any effect on Accident Rate? Airbags only deploy *after* and accident has occurred. But assuming he meant antilock brakes, then by this same logic, removing seatbelts from cars would lower accident rates as well. But it would still be a stupid thing to do...

BTW, if you're going to the trouble of quoting University Studies in a forum post, you might as well provide a link.

 

life without 9k is worse... AP1 ftw!!!