The dealer is giving you a load of crap. You took every reasonable precaution against damaging the engine, which was showing symptoms of a serious problem when it was still full of oil. This is assuming, of course, that the dealer is even telling the truth about it NOT being full of oil when it arrived there. BTW, I can't imagine what those fools must be smoking, even thinking of denying warranty coverage for an engine seizure on a new car.

I suggest getting in touch with your lawyer, then letting the Honda district-level people know that if they don't make you whole that they're in for a rocking-good hardball game. With publicity. Also, if you're not a hardass by nature, you'll want to take a few minutes and practice glaring and scowling in the mirror. You'd be surprised how well we hardasses get treated...

 

This is what I'm afraid of:
the two dealers and my insurance agree that it is one of three possibilities:
1) a rock or some road debris caused the damage (should be covered by insurance)
2) it was a faulty oil filter or workmarnship during the oil change was shotty (should be covered by dealer #1)
3) it wasn't the oil filters fault (should be covered under warranty)
So basically each can point the finger at someone else, and have probability on their side (1 out of 3). Then I would know that someone should cover it, noone is willing to cover it, big legal hassle.

I have know idea how this is going to end up, but I'm not feeling too good about it.

Chris

 

As the previous post said, the whole thing hinges on the filter and you DEF. need to get your insurance company involved. I see 3 possible conclusions to this:

1. Filter damaged by rock or other foreign object--Inssurance co. pays.

2. Filter left loose by whomever installed it --They pay.
(or, and this happens occassionally on Hondas--when filter was replaced the rubber o-ring stuck to block and didn't come off with filter. When new filter was installed there were now 2 o-rings and eventually one blew out. This happened to me on my 88 Prelude and it didn't happen until I really accelerated hard -high oil pressure-and it was TWO THOUSAND miles after replacing filter. Fortunately for me the oil fell on hot exhaust and I saw big cloud of smoke and stopped immed.) Either way shop that replaced filter is responsible- actually their ins. co is.

3. Filter defective-like a bad seam or weld-filter man. responsible.

4. Not really a filter problem-Honda responsible.

Get your ins. agent involved NOW and let HIM fight it out with dealer and/or Honda.

Andrew

 

[QUOTE]Originally posted by Tox
[B]Also, if you're not a hardass by nature, you'll want to take a few minutes and practice glaring and scowling in the mirror.

 

"Tap tap tap" and then seize is a defective #4 cylinder/piston until proven otherwise in my book. Check out these threads and see what you think.

http://www.s2000online.com/forums/showthre...p?threadid=2673

http://www.s2000online.com/forums/showthre...p?threadid=8051

http://www.s2000online.com/forums/showthre...p?threadid=7384

http://www.s2000online.com/forums/showthre...p?threadid=7978

Note that AHM has attributed most of these failures to too little oil and owner negligence. However, it is not at all clear whether the "tap tap tap" problem CAUSED the low oil or the low oil caused the "tap tap tap" problem. In at least two of the eight cases documented so far, the engines were not low on oil ever, including at the time the engines went in for service.

 

Barry-
Thanks for the research. Everytime I hear about the #4 faults, I think that is what it has to be. Unfortunately the second dealer (the one with the car) can't get past the hole in the oil filter. And even worse, since I'm about 3 hours away, I can't get down there to take a look at it.

I've left messages with the insurance claim adjuster. Hopefully he'll call me tomorrow. I figure if I'll try to "educate" him on past documented problems with the S2000, he might be able to throw the BS flag on the dealer and then act as my advocate to get Honda to fix it under warranty. It might backfire though, if he get convinced its something Honda needs to deal with and the dealerships are not willing to accept responsibility. What do you guys think about this?

Question to people who had the problem with the short blocks and oil consumption? Where did the oil go? The delaer claims he can see streaks of oil on the underside of the car going back to the exhaust. I think as if the oil was dripping, while I was driving the car, and the wind blew it back. Anybody else have this symptom?

Given that I can get a new engine... The car will never act the way it would have, with no problem. Do you think it is unreasonable to ask for a new S2000. I know that S2Klisa was able to do that, but I'm hoping I don't need to go through all that. Although it would definitely be worth it. I would go through all that just to get my new engine paid for. If not, I have an S2K with a dead engine for the next couple years. With my car payments and insurance, I have no money to pay for a new engine.

Man, I hope this all gets fixed before April 27th.

 

cde,

Good luck, at least it seems you won't be putting out your own money. BEWARE of Academy Honda. I went to buy an S2000 from them in Jan./2000. Long story short, they told me they had 3 (one I test drove, one in the showroom, ONE in the back) on the premise, my friend who was with me, went wandering, looked in their garage, and saw EIGHT!! They then offered $3000 over MSRP ONLY (their words) because I went through Auto-By-Tel. Crappy sales, hardly surprised they have crappy service. Again, good luck.

ERIK

 

Me too cde. If the dealer drags its heels on fixing the situation for you, maybe we can encourage a phalanx of New England S2000s to decend upon the dealer and lay down some "whoop-ass" .

 

If money and distance are a problem, you need to get a third party envolved (as several have already suggested). Preferably someone with a junk-yard dog personality, cause you sound like you're getting a good run-around.

I say start out reasonable but if that doesn't work - screaming on the show room floor, at peak sales hour, is a great attention and solution getter. You get my drift.

The problem initially arose and was questioned at the first dealer; make them accountable, even if you take it somewhere else for repairs.

A replacement engine should be just fine if done by competent people.

What is the Honda District Office saying? Do you have or can you get the so-called bad filter? If not, why not? If you have two dealer's saying there was no problem when they inspected it before - do you have it in writing on service orders? It's damn unlikely anything struck the oil filter, although it's not impossible...but if it did, I'd expect to see other strike marks in that same general area.

Focus on what's important. $9,000 is at stake. Don't be overly concern about meeting a time table, etc. First things first - make Honda accountable (it's either dealer screw-up or have the dealer prove it's not their fault).

Sic 'em. Good luck.

 

Cde..

I would add one more tangent to the idea that you need to be a hardass.

If they percieve you as not ABSOLUTELY sure it is not your own fault, they will assume that it is. So when you are hardassing, it is usually sufficient to be persistent and stubborn. Being reasonable and academic here is not the best solution. The best solution is along the lines of... "I don't know whose problem it is, but it is'nt mine. I took every precaution and still have this."

Finally, I think you have a simple solution here from the legal point of view. Call your insurance co. have them come inspect the famous filter. If it appears, and is properly damaged, he will pay. If it is not damaged, Insurance won't pay, and they won't be able to tell you that they it isn't under warranty. And finally, If they "Can't find" the filter... then they will be getting a call from the INSURANCE COMPANY's lawyer asking about losing evidence. Trust me, this will solve the problem.

Dan