Is a "processing fee" legitimate or a rip-off?
grab in this serious thread 
Registered User
Joined: Dec 2002
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From: Atlanta
Poindexter,
You lost me...why does the gov't care where a car is delivered?
I agree that many people want to see it and drive it before they buy it - I fit squarely in that category and want to touch it, sit in it and drive it before I buy it but I'm also someone who enjoys cars for more than their transportation value. I know and work with people who view their cars as nothing more than an appliance and feel no passion for what they drive. These folks look to buy a car as easily as possible and make up their minds before they even drive what they are interested in buying - usually based on comparisons they read. The test drive doesn't often change their minds about the purchase.
You lost me...why does the gov't care where a car is delivered?
I agree that many people want to see it and drive it before they buy it - I fit squarely in that category and want to touch it, sit in it and drive it before I buy it but I'm also someone who enjoys cars for more than their transportation value. I know and work with people who view their cars as nothing more than an appliance and feel no passion for what they drive. These folks look to buy a car as easily as possible and make up their minds before they even drive what they are interested in buying - usually based on comparisons they read. The test drive doesn't often change their minds about the purchase.
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Joined: Aug 2003
Posts: 155
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From: Rowlett
I keep seeing in this thread that the processing fees or doc fees are being slapped in AFTER the price is negotiated in the back room finance dept.
Having never bought a car in another state I can't say how the process typically goes in the other 49 but in Texas (at least in every dealer I've purchased from) the numbers are gone over line item by line item on the buyers order with the customer at the sales person's desk BEFORE the customer is introduced to finance.
This way the customer has the bottom line, out the door price and knows the exact dollar figure they are going to be financing for the purchase before ever talking with a finance manager. The only variance in price might be in the interest rate they qualify for, any last minute options they want added into the deal or additional warranties they want to add.
It seems from what I'm reading here that some dealers in some states are trying to play a real shell game with the numbers instead of just laying it all out on the table.
Having never bought a car in another state I can't say how the process typically goes in the other 49 but in Texas (at least in every dealer I've purchased from) the numbers are gone over line item by line item on the buyers order with the customer at the sales person's desk BEFORE the customer is introduced to finance.
This way the customer has the bottom line, out the door price and knows the exact dollar figure they are going to be financing for the purchase before ever talking with a finance manager. The only variance in price might be in the interest rate they qualify for, any last minute options they want added into the deal or additional warranties they want to add.
It seems from what I'm reading here that some dealers in some states are trying to play a real shell game with the numbers instead of just laying it all out on the table.
Former Moderator
Joined: Oct 2003
Posts: 24,162
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From: Burlington, VT
Originally posted by gas2k
Poindexter,
You lost me...why does the gov't care where a car is delivered?
Poindexter,
You lost me...why does the gov't care where a car is delivered?
I guess I can clarify that a little bit better - sorry.
The government may or may not care where the car is delivered, but they do care that Identity theft or fraud is not happening. The Privacy Act was passed to try to cut down on this and it gets more and more stringent with time
The Privacy Act does not come out and say a person "Must take delivery of the car at the dealership", but we like to have the contracting done at the dealership as a way of staying compliant with possible risks. I really can't explain it much more than that - you'll have to contact our lawyer for more details
Orinally posted by LemonHead
Having never bought a car in another state I can't say how the process typically goes in the other 49 but in Texas (at least in every dealer I've purchased from) the numbers are gone over line item by line item on the buyers order with the customer at the sales person's desk BEFORE the customer is introduced to finance.
Having never bought a car in another state I can't say how the process typically goes in the other 49 but in Texas (at least in every dealer I've purchased from) the numbers are gone over line item by line item on the buyers order with the customer at the sales person's desk BEFORE the customer is introduced to finance.
- I've bought all my cars (and sold a few) in Virginia
Registered User
Joined: Oct 2003
Posts: 152
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From: Columbia, SC
[QUOTE]Originally posted by LemonHead
I keep seeing in this thread that the processing fees or doc fees are being slapped in AFTER the price is negotiated in the back room finance dept.
Having never bought a car in another state I can't say how the process typically goes in the other 49 but in Texas (at least in every dealer I've purchased from) the numbers are gone over line item by line item on the buyers order with the customer at the sales person's desk BEFORE the customer is introduced to finance.
I keep seeing in this thread that the processing fees or doc fees are being slapped in AFTER the price is negotiated in the back room finance dept.
Having never bought a car in another state I can't say how the process typically goes in the other 49 but in Texas (at least in every dealer I've purchased from) the numbers are gone over line item by line item on the buyers order with the customer at the sales person's desk BEFORE the customer is introduced to finance.
Joined: Aug 2003
Posts: 9,583
Likes: 1
From: Columbia, SC
What LemonHead describes is exactly what I've experienced in the past, and therefore I've walked away. The comment I get is, "well everybody pays the processing fee." Well maybe so, but I guess we didn't have the deal we thought we did. Bye!
My problem is this. Let's not negotiate on a price and agree, only for me to find out that it is really going to cost ME more. I stated before there are two ways to do this:
1) Tell me the fees I am responsible up front, I will then determine the max I am willing to pay for the car INCLUDING those fees.
2) Lets simply talk about the out-the-door price. A lot of salespeople don't want to do this. A lot of salespeople don't like informed buyers.....
Just a week ago I was at a dealership in VA. I called a dealer local to where I was visiting to find out they had a Yellow S2000. I don't want a Yellow one, but I took advantage of the opportunity to see a lighter color with the new bumpers (I've only seen black until then). I didn't want to talk to a salesperson (but I'm going to anyway, right?). I hadn't even stepped out of my car, when there was a salesperson trying to shake my hand. I was friendly, but I was truthful in my comment that I was interested in an S2000, but was not going to be purchasing for awhile and that I was only there to see (and take a couple quick pics) the yellow one they had inside. I asked for a card, with the hopes I'd be done with her. NOPE! She stuck by as I walked around the car and she proceeded to tell me all the WRONG facts about the car. She also tried her best to persuade to me that I had to have the yellow one (Sorry, while it is one HOT color, it's not for me.). To make this already long story short, when I started telling the guy I was with all about the car, I suppose it made it abundantly clear to the salesperson that she hardly knew a fraction of what I know about the car. She even asked where I got my info (I mentioned S2kI.com, amoung others sources). It was at that point she stopped trying to sell me the car.
I got her card, and I'll give her a call when I get around to determining when I want to pick mine up. My point is, I have never been at a dealership where there wasn't pressure to buy. And, more and more (not just with cars) I find that there is always extra fees that the seller/salesperson does not want to divulge up front. I think that is completely unethical.
I want to take back what I said in a previous post. Not ALL salespeople will hate me. Most will. The ones I actually buy from will (and do) love me. No, I'm not going to waste a lot of a salesperson's time to save $100, but I WILL walk away if I know it's going to be a battle every step of the way. My last two car purchases were effortless. I had to walk away from several purchases, but in the end I found salespeople I could deal with. I bought a 00 Civic Si over the phone before it had even been built. I'll give that salesperson a shot at a deal as he was no-nonsense. I got a deal and he worked for all of about 30 minutes for that sale. We both won. Before that, a lot of BS salespeople got a lot of wasted time, including one (at the same dealership described above) that told my girlfriend that the only difference between an 00 Civic EX and Si was the alloy wheels, and she could add those at only ~$900. I was proud of my GF for pinning that @$$hole to the floor. I guess that goes to show just how many uninformed car buyers there still are out there that salespeople can get away with $#!+ like that. Or maybe it just goes to show how many uninformed salespeople are out there.
My problem is this. Let's not negotiate on a price and agree, only for me to find out that it is really going to cost ME more. I stated before there are two ways to do this:
1) Tell me the fees I am responsible up front, I will then determine the max I am willing to pay for the car INCLUDING those fees.
2) Lets simply talk about the out-the-door price. A lot of salespeople don't want to do this. A lot of salespeople don't like informed buyers.....
Just a week ago I was at a dealership in VA. I called a dealer local to where I was visiting to find out they had a Yellow S2000. I don't want a Yellow one, but I took advantage of the opportunity to see a lighter color with the new bumpers (I've only seen black until then). I didn't want to talk to a salesperson (but I'm going to anyway, right?). I hadn't even stepped out of my car, when there was a salesperson trying to shake my hand. I was friendly, but I was truthful in my comment that I was interested in an S2000, but was not going to be purchasing for awhile and that I was only there to see (and take a couple quick pics) the yellow one they had inside. I asked for a card, with the hopes I'd be done with her. NOPE! She stuck by as I walked around the car and she proceeded to tell me all the WRONG facts about the car. She also tried her best to persuade to me that I had to have the yellow one (Sorry, while it is one HOT color, it's not for me.). To make this already long story short, when I started telling the guy I was with all about the car, I suppose it made it abundantly clear to the salesperson that she hardly knew a fraction of what I know about the car. She even asked where I got my info (I mentioned S2kI.com, amoung others sources). It was at that point she stopped trying to sell me the car.
I got her card, and I'll give her a call when I get around to determining when I want to pick mine up. My point is, I have never been at a dealership where there wasn't pressure to buy. And, more and more (not just with cars) I find that there is always extra fees that the seller/salesperson does not want to divulge up front. I think that is completely unethical.
I want to take back what I said in a previous post. Not ALL salespeople will hate me. Most will. The ones I actually buy from will (and do) love me. No, I'm not going to waste a lot of a salesperson's time to save $100, but I WILL walk away if I know it's going to be a battle every step of the way. My last two car purchases were effortless. I had to walk away from several purchases, but in the end I found salespeople I could deal with. I bought a 00 Civic Si over the phone before it had even been built. I'll give that salesperson a shot at a deal as he was no-nonsense. I got a deal and he worked for all of about 30 minutes for that sale. We both won. Before that, a lot of BS salespeople got a lot of wasted time, including one (at the same dealership described above) that told my girlfriend that the only difference between an 00 Civic EX and Si was the alloy wheels, and she could add those at only ~$900. I was proud of my GF for pinning that @$$hole to the floor. I guess that goes to show just how many uninformed car buyers there still are out there that salespeople can get away with $#!+ like that. Or maybe it just goes to show how many uninformed salespeople are out there.
Former Moderator
Joined: Oct 2003
Posts: 24,162
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From: Burlington, VT
00CivicSI - why don't you buy your S2000 from a board member? I think all the car people on the board who have Honda franchises have figured that selling the S to another board member will be fun without much of a profit
You can contact AndyP or myself. Andy is in Maryland and I am in Norfolk, Virginia. If you contact me, I come in a package (for S2000 sales) with Hatty Matty
You can contact AndyP or myself. Andy is in Maryland and I am in Norfolk, Virginia. If you contact me, I come in a package (for S2000 sales) with Hatty Matty